Redefining Manhood as Boyish Immaturity

Male and Female perspectives on masculinity.

Readership: Christian Men
Reader’s Note: This is Part 1 of a series.
Length: 2,000 words
Reading Time: 7.5 minutes

Introduction

In a previous post, Ladies Should Respect the Man and Love the Boy (2018 June 28), I described a conversation I had with a student who was engaged to be married. Her primary complaint about her fiancée was,

“Sometimes he acts so immature, like a little boy!

She found this trait to be so ridiculous and annoying that she talked at some length about how much trouble it is for her to deal with this trait, and the disappointment she feels as a consequence.

Deep Strength commented,

“This is actually a good trait to have to be a good father. Interacting and playing with kids requires a certain amount of ability to set aside the seriousness of life and just enjoy being silly or crazy.

Also, Michal thought David was being “immature” (undignified) when he was dancing as the Ark of the Covenant was brought to Jerusalem. Look at how that turned out for her.

The issue is not maturity though. A woman’s preconceived notions of what they think is “mature” or not is their will manifesting as pride: they think they know what is better than the man they are with and are setting themselves up as the judge of that.”

This brilliant observation is certainly true. But nevertheless, most women do carry this opinion of most men.

In order to discuss the nature of this phenomenon, I’ll review several articles which expand on this female perspective, and add some commentary. These articles are older, liberal, and feminist, and are thus not to be regarded as Red Pill truth. However, I do think they express the general viewpoints of women very well.

Case Study 1 – Babyman

Psyche Central (feat. Samuel López De Victoria): Babyman… Is This Your Guy? (October 4, 2009)

This article begins with an embarrassing appeal to romantic chivalry, which Red Pillers know is not what women really want in a man. Then there is a short anecdote reviving the overworn trope of the harried housewife and the checked-out father. The author then makes three points that women struggle against.

  1. She argues that men “put on an act to get you”, that men are selfish and immature, and that it is natural for women to resent men whom they cannot respect.
  2. She claims that men have “developmental deficits”, and are spoiled from their youth.
  3. She explains how women are forced to take control of everything in order to survive, and that this is caused by her being “emotionally abandoned by her man”.

The article closes with some arrogant advice to women to either accept the role of being his surrogate mother, or dump the dude.

In a word, this whole article is simply solipsistic. She makes men out to be immature, but I strongly suspect that this is psychological projection. She is the one who is immature and out of control. I question the overall intelligence of women who take this stance.

Case Study 2 – Women Incite Emotional Drama

This article is a little more interesting.

Psychology Today (feat. William Berry): When Men Are Boys and Wives Are Mothers (February 14, 2011)

It attempts to explain that one reason why relationships become dysfunctional is because the male partner becomes “the child” in the relationship, while his female partner becomes “the mother”.

“Some men turn into boys and their wives into mothers.”

The article cites 5 ways the mother-child dynamic happens, which I’ve paraphrased and summarized here.

  1. From a woman’s perspective, men seem to approach dating and marriage differently. While dating, his impulsiveness, playfulness, and childlike charm are attractive and endearing. But when the responsibilities of marriage kick in, he becomes more serious and responsible.
  2. From a man’s perspective, women also seem to approach dating and marriage differently. While dating, women join men in “having fun” (e.g. drinking, dancing, and clubbing). But after marriage, women eschew these behaviors, especially after having children.
  3. Men suppress certain emotions, and the woman thinks it is her job to extract those emotions.
  4. According to ¡Science!, mothers and fathers approach childrearing differently. Mothers take on the role of caregivers while fathers take on the role of playmates.
  5. The article also claims that after having a child, men feel slighted or jealous of the woman’s time and attention given to the child.

All this is a nice little summary of men and women’s general behaviors in a relationship. But only point (3) addresses the issue of the mother-child dynamic. In fact, point (1) undermines the overall argument. Point (2) could be offered as a motivation for women to become nags, and if you think nagging is the same as mothering, then I can see how you might agree. Point (4) is about parenting roles, not about husband-wife roles.  This point could be extended to say that women have an instinctive nature to be mothering, but the author didn’t say this.

I strongly disagree with point (5). I think men feel this way because the wife is not making herself accessible (i.e. emotionally, sexually) to the man, and she uses the child as a justification for her withdrawal.

Taken together, these five points introduce some confusion about what it means to be “mothering” in this context. Does it mean being supportive, nurturing, warm, and caring, or does it mean being a scrupulous, hen pecking scold? I tend to think of the “mothering wife/adult manchild” dynamic as being more like the latter, but I can see how there might be elements of both.

In total, the takeaway from this article regarding the matron/manchild dynamic is that men are not responsible nor emotional enough for women’s tastes, and that it’s up to her to introduce the necessary degree of responsibility and incite emotional drama into the relationship. In order to change the interactional context into one that is congruent and conducive to this end, she must assert her dominance in the relationship. One common way women do this is to revert to the role of a mother, and treat the man like a child, which I’ll add, is extremely disrespectful. I covered this aspect before in Why do Women Incite Others to Emote? (2018 June 19). Although men are less emotional, this is hardly evidence that men are immature.

Case Study 3: The Giant Baby

Huffington Post (feat. David Wygant): 5 Reasons Why Men Are Giant Babies in Relationships (November 21, 2011; Updated Jan 20, 2012)

This article actually has some good suggestions about how women can love and respect a man by serving him drinks, giving massages, displaying boobs, and offering motivating compliments and encouragement. However, this advice is condescendingly framed as coddling an immature baby, and is therefore very disrespectful to masculinity in general.

And this is written by a “man”?  My word

Case Study 4: The Grown A$$ Man

Madamenoire (feat. Julia Austin): Are You Dealing With a Real Man Or A Little Boy? 7 Signs You’ve Got a Grown A** Man (June 19, 2012)

This article does us a real favor in clarifying that when a woman says she wants a “Real Man” she does not mean a beer guzzling, football watching, gym-obsessed brute that will start fights over her. She means someone who is mature, will treat her like a queen, is ready to be treated like a king and not take it for granted, and most importantly, who respects the sanctity* of a relationship.

Apparently, a man must not take any interest in drinking, sports, fitness training, or territory marking behaviors, because this would be “immature”. Instead, he must be somewhat chivalrous to m’lady. She goes on to list 7 habits of “mature” male conduct which I have interpreted as follows.

  1. He must not call her impulsively. Instead, he has to fit himself into her schedule.
  2. Regardless of the circumstances, he must accept all fault and admit that she is right. His priority is to make her haaappy! (Of course!)
  3. A real man wants to give to, not take from, a woman. He must offer commitment as a matter of course and be faithful without doubt or question. He cannot have any emotional or sexual needs that would require her to give something of herself to him. His only purpose is to make her feel “hot, unique, loved and all that good stuff”. (Naturally!)
  4. He must be willing to talk about his emotions and work things out on her terms. All the while, he must not get upset, raise his hand, turn away, hang up the phone, or shut down the conversation. He must also wholeheartedly agree with her, and not just agree for the sake of getting her to shut up. (Groan!)
  5. A real man never raises his voice or asserts his authority, but only does what is necessary to continue the relationship harmoniously. After all, the partnership is equal!
  6. He must never talk about his own problems, fears, or desires. As she wrote, “A real man takes responsibility for his own life and realizes it doesn’t suck because his boss is mean, his landlord is a jerk, he is overweight or whatever. It sucks because he made those choices and put himself in those situations, and only he can get himself out of them. And complaining is not the ticket.”
  7. He must bow down and worship her as a true, independent, equal.  As she says, “A real man likes a strong, opinionated, confident woman with a good head on her shoulders. He likes a woman who is the leader of her own life (and body) and is ambitious, has an active social life, is curious about the world, dresses however she wants and lives however she wants. A real man does not look in any way to control a woman. But a real man also understands that sometimes a real woman becomes emotional, and that he should never make her feel silly or bad for this. Instead, he should comfort her, let it pass, and let her get back to being her strong, bad@$$ self as if it never happened.” (LMAO… Is this “strong”? I’d say it’s typical feminine weakness.)

* Translation of “respecting the sanctity”: He must defer obeisant fealty to her royal pain-in-the-@$$ imagined feminine dominance.

I think we’re starting to get the picture now. Anything extraneous to the feminine imperative is boyish immaturity.

Case Study 5: Men are like Babies

Cosmopolitan (feat. Hannah Smothers): 24 Ways Men Are Just Like Babies (April 14, 2016)

This article is full of subjective assessments, but I’ll try to interpret these as best as I can. These are all purported to be symptoms of male “immaturity”.

  1. He doesn’t eat what she wants him to eat without any objections.
  2. He expects an immediate response.
  3. He asks her opinion about what he should wear.
  4. He gets sick.
  5. He expects sympathy and care when he is sick.
  6. He won’t go to the doctor when she decides he should do so.
  7. He expects praise for small accomplishments.
  8. He loves to suck on boobs like a baby.
  9. He prefers hamburgers over fine cuisine.
  10. His sleeplessness and the carnal urgency arising from his nocturnal erections keep her awake at night.
  11. He doesn’t like to be “cuddled” (c.f. disrespected) when she wants to “cuddle” (c.f. disarm his defenses with feminine wiles).
  12. He isn’t a die-hard shopaholic and is insufficiently resolved to find ways to spend his money.
  13. He has particular tastes (e.g. his mom’s spaghetti sauce).
  14. He is insensitive to her more refined tastes in his choices of clothing.
  15. He gets obsessed with new tools, toys, gadgets, and hobbies.
  16. He puts ketchup on his steaks.
  17. He speaks in monosyllabic grunts.
  18. He leaves his clothes on the floor.
  19. He wants to keep some of his personal items in her purse.
  20. “They skip hungry and immediately go to hangry, and hangry involves a lot of temper tantrums.”
  21. He has certain expectations of her that she doesn’t agree or feel comfortable with. For example, he won’t do things he doesn’t want to do (e.g. wash dishes) with the implicit assumption that she will do it.
  22. His habits of cleanliness are not up to her expectations.
  23. He has constant ego needs which manifest as restlessness and impatience (e.g. channel surfing during commercials).
  24. He asks questions about where she keeps things.

The general message here is that if a man has any need for love, affection, or encouragement, then he is a baby. On the other hand, mature men are inhuman!

Some items on this list are merely differences in taste. In fact, these seem like a laundry list of assorted economic class differences that might show up when a jaded, post-wall, UC snob is dating a younger, hawt, LC boytoy. Other items on this list are the simple daily annoyances commonly experienced by those who are incapable of extending any common graces to the other. I suppose we could truly call this immaturity, but if we are going to adopt this perspective, then the article is completely one-sided. I imagine her partner could come up with an even longer list of complementary annoyances about her. But I’m sure that as long as she’s putting out, it’s mostly irrelevant to him.

Conclusions

The lessons we’ve gained from these case studies are given here.

  1. Case Study 1 – Women are solipsistic.
  2. Case Study 2 – Men suppress certain emotions, and the woman thinks it is her job to extract those emotions.  Playing the mother is the most satisfying way (for her) to do this.
  3. Case Study 3 – There is a marked display of disrespect towards men and masculinity in general.
  4. Case Study 4 – Anything extraneous to the feminine imperative is labeled boyish immaturity.
  5. Case Study 5 – Any symptom of human frailty is boyish immaturity.

Now I’m beginning to understand why most women think men are immature boys!

As you can see, the general opinion of the Feminazified social culture is that men are wussified simps, who are totally emotionally inept. The humanity of men is portrayed either as an intrinsic, contemptible flaw in males, or else a failure of men to develop their emotional sides.

Give me a break. Isn’t there another theoretical option besides ‘flaw’ or ‘failure’?

More positively, this review could have a few other conclusions, or be extended to other applications:

  1. The easiest way for a man to become an immature boy is to let wimmin set the frame by redefining manhood and what it means to be mature.
  2. The above lists could be revamped into a male version of the $h!t test — Just do all the things on those lists, and see how much she truly loves you!
  3. To those thoroughly annoyed men who are looking to tick a frumpy wimmyn off, he could “agree and amplify” the “immaturity” just to test her limits and keep her on her toes.
  4. To those men who want to shed the pesky love of a bothersome wimmyn, indulging in “immaturity” (as described above) could be a passive-aggressive way to get her to dump you. Just be more “immature” and count the milliseconds to see how long she’ll last.

Best wishes~!

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About Jack

Jack is a world traveling artist, skilled in trading ideas and information, none of which are considered too holy, too nerdy, nor too profane to hijack and twist into useful fashion. Sigma Frame Mindsets and methods for building and maintaining a masculine Frame
This entry was posted in Boundaries, Choosing a Partner or Spouse, Communications, Complementarianism, Conflict Management, Courtship and Marriage, Discerning Lies and Deception, Disorders, Female Power, Feminism, Game Theory, Handling Rejection, Holding Frame, Influence, Maturity, Personal Growth and Development, Models of Failure, Organization and Structure, Personal Presentation, Psychology, Relationships, Respect, Reviews, Science, Self-Concept, Solipsism, Vetting Women. Bookmark the permalink.

42 Responses to Redefining Manhood as Boyish Immaturity

  1. professorGBFMtm2021 says:

    Who demands to be treated like royalty in any relationship or situation,men or women?
    That dos’nt anwser who is the immature one?
    Men will happily be ”lowly” soldiers&warriors!
    Also where is all the female weilders&mechanics that are needed more than princesses ever will be!?
    Theirs a huge surplus market of ”adult”princess wimminz!
    Men are always called on by princesses to do the heavy lifting in RL!

    Liked by 4 people

  2. rontomlinson2 says:

    This is actually a good trait to have to be a good father. Interacting and playing with kids requires a certain amount of ability to set aside the seriousness of life and just enjoy being silly or crazy

    Yes! Playfulness is vital. In animals for example playing is preparation for serious fighting later in life. Rough and tumble games with Dad are analogous to this. To this I would add verbal games, word-play and mild teasing as a uniquely human component. (Naturally done with full regard for everybody’s feelings, just as tig/tag is done without intent to injure). This can be seen as preparation for verbal sparring and dealing with bullies later in life.

    Playfulness is a component of seduction. Playfulness is part of problem-solving. A man must be able to play with ideas, at least in the privacy of his own head, if he’s going to build new stuff. So he must keeps that space open and available, however much he is nagged, however responsible and sober he must appear to the outside world.

    Liked by 5 people

    • feeriker says:

      Good points, all.

      Women don’t hate men being playful because it’s “immature;” they hate men being playful because men usually do so with other men, in a masculine environment, and it’s seen as taking attention away from the woman and her wants.

      Liked by 2 people

      • rontomlinson2 says:

        Thanks, Feeriker.

        Btw I just tracked down an example from the film Amadeus where Mozart is accused (correctly) by his mother-in-law of behaving childishly and yet he manages to turn even this into fuel for his work:

        Liked by 1 person

  3. redpillboomer says:

    “As she wrote, ‘A real man takes responsibility for his own life and realizes it doesn’t suck because his boss is mean, his landlord is a jerk, he is overweight or whatever. It sucks because he made those choices and put himself in those situations, and only he can get himself out of them. And complaining is not the ticket.'”

    Actually, this one is good for BOTH sexes. If we could ever get a critical mass in our culture to accept this one statement she made, “It sucks because he made those choices and put himself in those situations, and only he can get himself out of them,” we’d solve one h*ll of a lot of problems in our society. I know my ‘old-school mentality’ is showing on this one, but it would help tremendously if we could get men and women to accept this REALITY, and then DO SOMETHING with it, and not just sit back and ‘play the victim’ all day long. There are legitimate victims out there, some yes, but most, are only victim of their own choices, and not someone else.

    I’ll use one example, a late thirties woman I know from a previous educational program and her recent FB posts I’ve noticed. She has been spouting off on social media about misogyny, and men being this, that and the other with her and ‘women in general;’ this after she has spent the last two decades riding the CC. Now, she wants Mr. Chivalrous BetaBux Deluxe to ‘man up’ and give her the life she feels she deserves–white picket fence, children, et al. Two things with this related to choices: 1) After her latest FB rant, I thought, “Who chose to spread your legs for Chad the last two decades? Chad couldn’t spread them unless you let him or it would have been rape. You chose to do that deary! It wasn’t misogyny! It was stupidity and now you’re feeling the consequences of that lifestyle!” 2) After getting a little push back from her friends and family on FB, she whines about how her speaking her ‘truth’ brings out the ‘haters.’ I’m thinking, “No, they’re embarrassed that you publicly are ‘speaking your truth’ and it’s making you look so incredibly foolish, and by extension them as well being your family members and close friends! They’re embarrassed you’re on a public campaign on social media to ‘clean up’ this incredibly misogynistic society we live in, and you are arguing from a completely hypocritical platform– the former CC rider turned social reformer.” Jeez Louise you can’t make this stuff up!

    Liked by 2 people

  4. feeriker says:

    As she wrote: “A real man takes responsibility for his own life and realizes it doesn’t suck because his boss is mean, his landlord is a jerk, he is overweight or whatever. It sucks because he made those choices and put himself in those situations, and only he can get himself out of them. And complaining is not the ticket.”

    Actually, this one is good for BOTH sexes.

    However true her statement might be, it’s absolutely meaningless coming from her. Until women in any significant numbers can regularly start walking the talk on this one, they really need to just STFU.

    Liked by 3 people

  5. info says:

    Looks like so called immaturity is a good thing. And a good screening out tool. If a man cannot be human and childlike. Then said woman doesn’t deserve him either.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Rock Kitaro says:

      Bought some new knuckle-padded tactical gloves and was so happy to have them that I wore it on my boss’s radio show. The female co-host who’s my age kept questioning why I was wearing them, getting annoyed at my enjoyment, and I just chuckled, “I like wearing gloves. Makes me happy. What’s up?”

      She hated me the whole show.

      Liked by 1 person

  6. Scott says:

    That last case is silly, and also filled with double standards.

    I’ve noticed that double standards are indeed the rule in modern, egalitarian marriage/relationships.

    If she has to ask me 50 times what time my last patient is, I just calmly respond “4-5, ill be headed out the door around 515.”

    But if I have to ask what’s for dinner. “You never listen. I told you 8 days ago when we were planning weekend meals.”

    The reason for this is, I do not allow myself to get wrapped around the axle over what she did or did not process at the time I said it. Maybe she was busy. Maybe she was distracted. What cost is it to me if I have to say it again? No big deal.

    But my Lord, forget some minor detail like where the scissors are kept or when the next hair appointment is, and “you NEVER listen.”

    This is the culture we live in. Men are stupid dolts who cannot find their way out of a wet paper bag. Their wives are holding the entire family operation in the palms of their hands, thankfully.

    And even the “conservative” ones do this. It is baked into the cake now.

    Liked by 6 people

    • redpillboomer says:

      “you NEVER listen.”

      This is one thing I’ve had to work on breaking with my wife, the “You never!’ or the “You Always.” Poor female reasoning when arguing.

      Liked by 3 people

      • feeriker says:

        Poor female reasoning when arguing

        What “reasoning?” It’s all about her emotions-of-the-moment, not logic, reason, or reality. I don’t think most women are even neurologically wired to be able to argue rationally.

        Liked by 1 person

    • thedeti says:

      And my response to the “you never listen” is

      Look. I work 10, 12, 14 hour days. I have work to think about. I don’t have time to keep track of this or that social calendar thing. We split things up for a reason – I work, you take care of the house. The social schedule is your responsibility.

      I don’t expect you to know when this or that bill needs to get paid. I don’t expect you to know what project at work needs to get done when. So don’t complain at me just because I didn’t remember when your Aunt Gertrude is coming over to look at the tulips.

      Liked by 4 people

      • cameron232 says:

        I don’t ever get this reaction from her.

        She understands that my mind wanders a lot so if I’m not listening she doesn’t take it as an insult. She sees some of our sons do this which makes her understand it isn’t just me not valuing what she says.

        Liked by 2 people

      • feeriker says:

        I recall Scott bringing this up before somewhere, but men’s work burdens, the soul-crushing sources of stress we carry every day while navigating the minefield that is today’s workplace, don’t register at all with wives. They “don’t count,” because they’re not about HER.

        Liked by 3 people

      • Red Pill Apostle says:

        feeriker – “I recall Scott bringing this up before somewhere, but men’s work burdens, the soul-crushing sources of stress we carry every day while navigating the minefield that is today’s workplace, don’t register at all with wives. They “don’t count,” because they’re not about HER.”

        When I was starting out in my business I had no salary so my income what what I produced. At the time my oldest was less than a year and we had decided that it was best for the family for Mrs. Apostle to get as much time with the kiddo as we could afford so she had taken a part time job. We had gone from 2 incomes with no kids to half an income, one kid and whatever I could do in getting a business off the ground. The stress was immense. For two years I worked like crazy during the week, took calls on weekends and barely took any time off. My reward at home was a sexless marriage, consistent complaining about how I worked too much and that being alone with a baby was hard yada, yada, yada. Solipsism at it’s finest.

        Liked by 2 people

    • Red Pill Apostle says:

      Mrs. Apostle is famous for arguing or complaining with “you never…” and “you always…” statements. The telling aspect of those statements is that they are almost always accusational and are typically associated with an emotional outburst. I used to argue back because I was a naïve idiot. Then I started calling her on the absoluteness of her outburst which moved me to merely being an idiot. Now she mostly checks herself on accusational absolute statements. But those times when she lets one go there is no more arguing or discussion just a one word question such as “Really?” delivered with a tone and expression that communicates the absurdity of her statement. Then she can get to the heart of what is really bothering her.

      One thing Mrs. Apostle has missed, and I would gather that other women do as well, is that the “you never…” and “you always…” statements are amongst those types of communication that erode trust. These statements don’t engender problem solving or seek understanding. First, they are a power grab accusation in that you are never/always behaving in such a way that displeases the woman and you better comply with the changes I want or you’ll get the worst she can muster until you come around. Second, it is a demonstration of an emotional wave overtaking intelligent thought and reason. This is certainly part of what is meant in Proverbs by a foolish woman tearing her house down with her own hands.

      For me personally, this type of behavior from Mrs. Apostle along with other aspects of how she has acted over the years, has led me to trust her very little. There are certain areas in life where I consider her input, but on the vast majority of subjects I have found her decision making to be detrimental to me and the family. So I just listen, nod, smile, offer a platitude and then change the subject. I have been burned enough that I am firmly in “shame on me” territory if I fall for it.

      Liked by 4 people

      • feeriker says:

        One thing Mrs. Apostle has missed, and I would gather that other women do as well, is that the “you never…” and “you always…” statements are amongst those types of communication that erode trust. These statements don’t engender problem solving or seek understanding.

        it’s NEVER about problem solving or reason. Solving the problem = removing the drama, which, for a woman, is like depriving her of oxygen. This famous and timeless video illustrates things perfectly:

        Liked by 2 people

    • Rock Kitaro says:

      I actually saw a Youtube video titled the top “50 Differences Between Men and Women” and listening was one of them. The speaker made a point about how boys are able to tune out noise a lot better than women to focus on a task. So if a woman repeats herself to you, or starts to nag, a guy is likely to treat it like background noise to focus on something else and simply not hear her. Just a theory…

      Liked by 2 people

      • Red Pill Apostle says:

        Rock – This is why men tend to like activities like golf and hunting. Focus on one thing. Block out distractions. Complete the goal. Move on to the next task.

        Liked by 1 person

    • locustsplease says:

      When I was married I remodeled bathrooms, whole new flooring and shower, replaced roof, did major auto repairs, decking, graded the entire back yard… She replaced the kitchen cabinet knobs 1 time. Yet, she insisted until we split that I was not handy around the house, and that she was, and she even included this statement in the divorce manifesto docs!

      Like

  7. Scott says:

    Men are not “less” emotional.

    We experience the full range of emotional content that everyone does.

    Our conditioning tells us that we must temper that emotional content and channel it into more productive avenues

    It’s why buildings, inventions, space travel, romantic music and poetry exist.

    Never let the narrative make you feel that you are less emotionally sophisticated because you are man. It’s actually the other way around.

    Liked by 5 people

    • Scott says:

      Men understand instinctively that depth of emotion does not always mean outward expression of it giving into its basest impulses. The aesthetic reasons for restraint are elevating to the human condition.

      Liked by 4 people

  8. Scott says:

    This idea of men-as-emotionally-unsophisticated is a grand lie as big as the other one: that women’s intuition is somehow the divining rod of “true love.”

    Most modern women wouldn’t know true love if it walked up and socked them in the mouth.

    A husband who works at a job he hates to provide a comfortable living, and comes home to passionless, sexless marriage because of her resentment and malcontent attitude is the embodiment of true love. He gets up every day and tries to figure out what she wants to keep her happy, so he can be with his children out of fear of the divorce grinder.

    Liked by 4 people

    • cameron232 says:

      You’re saying willing the good for others even to your own detriment is love. Sounds like Jesus. They’ll never get that – most of them anyway- because their love consists solely of solipsistic feelings. What you describe doesn’t count. They’ll recognize it (in terms of verbal reward) only when they feel they have to because the gravy train might derail. You get no credit for working the job you hate for most of your life – no credit in terms of their emotions towards you. Cause that’s what men do – work.

      My wife once said women love deeply – to me implying that men don’t (at least relative to women). Thought that statement was a total crock. I think translated it meant that when they experience solipsistic feelings of love they experience them intensely.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Red Pill Apostle says:

      “Most modern women wouldn’t know true love if it walked up and socked them in the mouth.”

      Hence men’s affinity for dogs..

      “A husband who works at a job he hates to provide a comfortable living, and comes home to passionless, sexless marriage because of her resentment and malcontent attitude is the embodiment of true love. He gets up every day and tries to figure out what she wants to keep her happy, so he can be with his children out of fear of the divorce grinder.”

      Doing things that keep things together for the kids is spot on, but keeping her happy, well not even sinless Adam in the garden could keep her happy. I’d also include keeping vows to this as keeping commitments through longsuffering is certainly much more a male trait in my experience.

      Like

      • Scott says:

        Correct, but what I am really saying is, “he doesn’t want to watch his children go through the soul-crushing effects of watching parents divorce.”

        When a woman divorces her husband because of her CURRENT mood state, she is saying “my happiness is more important than the irreparable damage this will do these little innocent ones.”

        It is heart breaking to point it out, but that is what the situation is right now. Maybe it always was.

        Liked by 3 people

      • Red Pill Apostle says:

        “he doesn’t want to watch his children go through the soul-crushing effects of watching parents divorce”

        When you write it this way it mirrors my thought process for why I stayed married to Mrs. A. I simply could not do that to my boys, even as this was used against me as leverage. The vows are extremely important to me as well, but I had enough years of being sexually defrauded that I would have had a clear conscience should I have divorced her.

        Like

  9. Jeff Barnes says:

    The best place to go if your MGTOW man is Mt Athos. No women allowed. I know I am going to be an Orthodox monk, now its just a matter of where and when. Why bother watching modern society crumble? Would you rather be lost on earth or lost in the heavens? (St. Paisios, I believe)

    Also the elites who want to depopulate the planet will hopefully ignore us monks. That was humorous thought that occurred to me recently.

    Like

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  12. horsemanbombadil says:

    So what exactly is the incentive for men to ever pairbond?

    Like

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