Abandonment Issues

Does your significant other start a fight every time you walk out the door?

Readership: All

I have decided to do some live-stream/call-in stuff on my YouTube channel, because it seems this is the best way I can reach people who need what I can offer.

To start with, I want to talk a little about personality disorders, and some other psychopathology that Red Pill YouTubers sometimes don’t have the clinical expertise to deal with on their shows.

So here’s my first video.

In this video, I’m covering another video about Narcissism from a popular YouTube personality, Richard [couldn’t catch his last name].

One important distinction that Richard makes is that there is a popular but false notion that culture has become narcissistic.

“If you look at the mass of people… our culture has become narcissistic. But if you look at the traits for classic grandiose Narcissism and compare them to the traits of Borderline Personality Disorder, we’ve actually become far more Borderline than we have become Narcissist.”

He goes over the nine traits of BPD with some interesting amplifications. But in this video, I’ll just cover the first one: “Fear of Abandonment”.  As Richard says, this is actually better described as a soul-numbing, world-stopping “abandonment terror”.

If you meet up with a person who has abandonment issues, I’d advise you to pass.

But if you decide to pursue that relationship with the confidence that you could be the person who could deal with that, or if you are already joined to such a person, then I have some professional advice for that.

What can I do?

First of all, you have to identify the problem correctly.

Sometimes, people with this issue will usually announce to you pretty early in the relationship that they have abandonment issues, and they can even pinpoint the exact childhood event that triggered this pathology.

But in general, the person is either unaware of their pathology, or they are unaware of its effects. They don’t understand that no one actually causes you to feel anything.

What does it mean to have abandonment issues?

It means, if you leave on a business trip for a few days, then she’s going to start a fight.  She does this because she cannot handle the idea of abandonment, so she will auto-reject you in order to avoid the possibility of you leaving her first.

Picking fights before a time of separation indicates that the person has not yet overcome their pathology.

How do you deal with this?

You have to ask the person…

  • Can you describe what your abandonment issue means to you?
  • How does this manifest in day to day living?

Then you have to honestly ask yourself…

  • Am I going to be able to deal with that?

On my YouTube channel, I will continue to go over some case studies of guys dealing with women with abandonment issues, so if this is of interest to you, then you can subscribe to my YouTube channel and stay tuned.

For professional advice, you can call me at 406-594-1168, or write it up in an email, and send it to…

scott@treasurestatepsychological.com

For guys who are reading and commenting here, I’d like for you to think about relationships that you’ve been in in the past, with girls who have said they have abandonment issues. If you have a story to tell, this would make for a great discussion towards increasing our general knowledge of the topic.

Related

This entry was posted in Choosing a Partner or Spouse, Disorders, Psychology, Relationships, Vetting Women. Bookmark the permalink.

29 Responses to Abandonment Issues

  1. cameron232 says:

    I only have n=1 experience but I might be the more likely of the two to have abandonmnet issues. On our 2nd date, I told her I was afraid of her “leaving me” or something like that. Maybe I was just afraid of going back to being a thirsty male teenager – either way it all worked out.
    When I am (rarely ) on business travel, I hate being alone in a hotel room.
    Background, I’m from a normal, stable family with a very loving father and a stay-at-home mother – no traumatic childhood events.

    Like

  2. Scott says:

    Question for the Christian red pill community. No particular time limit on this and completely off topic for this thread. Just wanted to know.

    Was it “beta” for Ronald Reagan to write eloquent, hand-written love letters to his wife all the way up to the end like he did? (I presume he wasn’t writing them in the worst of his Alzheimer’s progression, but you get what I am saying).

    I do shit like that for Mychael all the time and she purrs like a kitten when I do.

    Liked by 1 person

    • cameron232 says:

      Maybe. Women like alpha and beta characteristics, different women like them to different degrees and it’s also a function of I think the woman’s age, stage of life, experiences, as well as individual personality differences. It probably doesn’t hurt that you have a number of “alpha” characteristics too.

      I did something like this when my marriage was having problems – I don’t think it helped or hurt.

      There are things you see in real life that the manosphere doesn’t notice. In addition to “shit testing” (which I’m sure happens but I’ve never been shit tested) women also sometimes test whether or not you love them (not the same thing).

      Like

      • thedeti says:

        women also sometimes test whether or not you love them (not the same thing).

        That’s called “comfort testing”. I think Athol Kay used to write about this. The Married Red Pill subreddit writes about this too

        r/marriedredpill

        Like

    • Ed Hurst says:

      You may be aware of any number of handy-dandy lists of what makes a wife feel loved and appreciated. One that I still like to use comes out of some decent series of manhood studies at some church long ago. It suggests your woman can tell you if her preference is one of: words, touch, discrete objects, acts of support, or time. My wife does like words, poems and letters, but if I really want to keep the fire burning, she’s all about the touch. So my reply is qualified: If Reagan’s wife was a fan of words of love, then his letters were just smart husband action.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Ed Hurst says:

        Found it: Authentic Manhood series by Robert Lewis. It’s a mixture of junk with some good clinical material.

        Like

      • Jack says:

        Ed wrote,

        “… your woman can tell you if her preference is one of: words, touch, discrete objects, acts of support, or time.”

        This sounds very similar to The 5 Love Languages by Gary Chapman. At one time, Scott mentioned that in his experience as a professional psychologist, understanding the five love languages was insightful for helping people know themselves better, but it was useless towards improving the marriage.

        Like

      • Joe2 says:

        Reagan was called the Great Communicator. I think his communication skills were also demonstrated through the writing of letters which came naturally to him. For example, Reagan wrote 276 personal notes over 50 years to Lorraine Wagner, a fan he had met in 1943, when he was married to Jane Wyman and there were divorce rumors. These were published in the 2003 book “Reagan: A Life in Letters.” So what we may believe was smart husband action, may just have been Reagan doing what came naturally to him. By the way Reagan married Jane Wyman when she was 23 and already TWICE divorced. Her first marriage was at age 16.

        Like

    • Novaseeker says:

      Context is everything.

      A woman who is already very attracted to her husband will respond well to acts of affection from him, tailored to her specific preferred means of receiving affection (as Ed notes).

      A woman whose attraction is so-so or is waning or has become unattracted to her husband is not going to be as receptive, or receptive at all, to the exact same gestures, even if they are tailored to her own specific form of affection, because they are incongruent with her own feelings, and this feels creepy to her.

      The sphere is often addressing men who are having attraction issues, both inside and outside of marriages. If a man is not having attraction issues, then much of the sphere is superfluous for him as long as he has no issue maintaining the attraction (which he likely doesn’t if he is in a long term marriage with no attraction issues).

      Liked by 2 people

      • cameron232 says:

        “context is everything” Yes. The women who tolerate physically abusive husbands – often the man is attractive, (maybe in the rugged way more than pretty boy way.) There’s this idea that one-in-a-while pops up in the sphere that if a man literally whips his woman’s ass, she’ll somehow get all hot for him. I’m guesssing that wouldn’t work out real well for the average guy.

        Like

    • Lexet Blog says:

      Reagan lived a hard core life. His ranch was minimalist and primitive. He was wealthy, attractive, healthy, and had a sense of humor. He was powerful too, having governed the largest state and then became president.

      (He was also a player in his Hollywood days).

      I don’t think writing letters later in life makes him beta.

      *emphasis on the later in life deal. I don’t think these types of letters (or giving them to you wife) is the greatest idea within the first few years.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Sharkly says:

      Men are to love their wives, as much as they love themselves, but far less than they are to love God. So, a man who thinks poorly of himself will probably make a poor lover. The problem in our society is that people have warped ideas about what “love” looks like. When your wife is being loyal and virtuous, love looks like affirmation of her behavior, and desiring what is best for her. However when your wife or child is defiant and acting poorly, then love takes the form of correction and discipline, because true love always desires what is right and best for them.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Oscar says:

      If you’re eloquent, and she gets all gooey when you write her love letters, do it. What do you have to lose? The respect of anonymous randos on the internet?

      Liked by 3 people

    • thedeti says:

      Whether it’s “beta” depends on whether sexual attraction predates the letter writing. You can’t write love letters to a woman who’s not sexually attracted to you. Writing love letters to a woman who isn’t sexually attracted to you (despite whether you’re in a relationship with her or married to her) is worse than beta, it’s simping. Writing love letters to a woman who isn’t sexually attracted to you will not create sexual attraction. (Ask me how I know.)

      Nancy Reagan was completely and totally smitten with her husband, and had been from the very beginning. Keep in mind that that was not necessarily so for his first wife, Jane Wyman. Wyman divorced Reagan after their work kept them separated and she just fell out of love with him. The divorce absolutely crushed Reagan and sent him into a deep depression for about a year.

      Like

  3. Lexet Blog says:

    One of these days I will post a review of the book, but back in the late 60s, Christopher lasch published The Culture of Narcissism.

    He pinpointed the decay in our culture long before people realized it had happened.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. Farm Boy says:

    My ex was a borderline. You have not fully lived life until you have been married to one

    Liked by 4 people

  5. lastmod says:

    according to Game. Totally beta. Reagan did love Nancy dearly though. He was a terrible president but on matters of family, commitment to said family and his wife…well I have no problem with him there

    Like

    • thedeti says:

      Reagan did love Nancy dearly though.

      And she loved him just as dearly. And she was attracted to him. And that makes all the difference.

      The issue is not how much he loved her. The response a man gets from writing love letters to a woman is how she feels about him.

      Like

      • lastmod says:

        Okay Deti….I agree with you…..but how do you know. For years I have been hearing “she puts up a front then gets the cash n prizes” or “she sticks the landing with a beta and divorces him” so how does one determine “the feels” and if they are genuine?

        So yes, Reagan according to the ‘sphere was a cuck

        Like

  6. Oscar says:

    Scott,

    What you describe is really common in the military. So much so, that I heard it mentioned in a lot of pre-deployment classes. Why do you think that is? Are women with abandonment issues more likely to be attracted to military men? Or are abandonment issues that common among women? Or is it something else?

    Like

    • Scott says:

      Oscar-

      We’ve been out of comms for a while, so I emplore you to watch this–the whole thing.

      I go over this in great detail with Rich Cooper and Shawn Smith here.

      Lets discuss, as its important if you are staying in, and leading soldiers.

      Like

      • Oscar says:

        Scott,

        I finished watching the video. Actually, re-watching. I watched it when it was first posted, but had forgotten about it since. I’m glad I re-watched it. I’ll write a longer response to it later.

        Like

      • Scott says:

        Excellent. Have a great Christmas brother.

        Like

      • Oscar says:

        Merry American Christmas to you, brother!

        Like

  7. Elspeth says:

    This sounds very similar to The 5 Love Languages by Gary Chapman. At one time, Scott mentioned that in his experience as a professional psychologist, understanding the five love languages was insightful for helping people know themselves better, but it was useless towards improving the marriage.

    I strongly disagree that the 5LL is about knowing oneself better. What could possibly be the reason for examining how I receive love? I already love me too much as it is.

    I am a moderate proponent of the 5LL, but ONLY as a tool to observe and understand what your husband (or wife) experiences as a loving act. If I like to talk a lot and hear how great I am (affirmation), but my husband isn’t into that, then the 5LL as a self-examination tool only helps me navel gaze more and totally miss the fact that -in my specific case- my husband strongly prefers physical touch (aside from just intimacy). Used this way, it creates resentment towards your spouse.

    The 5LL can help a marriage when its about love, which by definition is focused on someone else. You don’t really need to book though. You just need to be attentive to the needs of someone other than yourself.

    Liked by 1 person

    • redpillboomer says:

      “The 5LL can help a marriage when its about love, which by definition is focused on someone else. You don’t really need to book though. You just need to be attentive to the needs of someone other than yourself.”
      5LL, like a lot of ‘pop psychology’ in the Relationship improvement industry, has some usefulness, but you can’t build a relationship around it. In other words, it helps a bit, but it is not a ‘be all and end all’ or ‘silver bullet’ for Relational improvement which I think ends up happening with a lot of this type literature also see ‘Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus’ and books of it’s ilk.

      My wife and I have used it, her top LL’s are Physical Touch and Words of Affirmation; and yes, it helps when I’m aware enough to remember to touch her the way she likes to be touched–hugs, kisses, playful swats on the ass while she’s working in the kitchen, that type of thing; or saying an affirming word or two about something she’s done well in. She likes sincere praise.

      Since getting Red Pilled several years ago, I’ve worked my way through hours of secular manosphere and now Christian Red Pill content creator’s materials (a lot of YouTubes, some reading). My conclusion is this, the Scriptures are the true ‘red pill’ that allows you to see the ‘lines in the matrix.’ The Red Pill, Blue Pill is a good metaphor for what seeing the truth is; and when seen from the Biblical viewpoint, it becomes truth with a capital T.

      What I’m coming to see more clearly, the whole Relational industry, when it’s being accurate is truth with a small t. I’ve begun to put the Biblical verses together and look at them for insight into relational truth with a Capital T. It is an interesting approach. It seems like everything finds it’s way back to the Fall, Adam and Eve set the whole template for everything we’re dealing with in the relational shit show going on in today’s world.
      Likewise, Christ restored the possibility of relationships working in today’s modern world the CLOSER and CLOSER we get to the Biblical model (Old Testament verses, Christ words and New Testament verses involving relationships). It’s amazing that it works for the secular realm as well. The closer they get to the Biblical model, the more their relationships start working too. The further they get, the bigger the shit show becomes.

      Liked by 4 people

  8. Oscar says:

    Scott,

    Here’s the longer comment on your video with Rich Cooper and Shawn Smith.

    First, I think you’re right that military bases attract a lot of low-quality women. I saw this as a junior enlisted man. The good girls (wisely) wanted nothing to do with us junior enlisted men. The girls that dated junior enlisted men were trashy. I completely gave up on even trying to date when I was stationed at Ft. Knox, KY.

    That’s also why I made three goals for myself when I went to college.
    1. Earn a degree in mechanical engineering.
    2. Earn a commission to the Engineer Corps.
    3. Find a wife.
    Fortunately, I achieved all three.

    I didn’t want to be stuck in the same predicament again. Of course, what I didn’t realize is that officers have a much easier time finding quality girls to date. Ft. Riley, KS may be the Army’s best kept secret for young, male officers. Young, single Lieutenants and Captains there have no problem finding quality girls at K-State in Manhattan, KS. I know this from observation, not experience. I was married with 6-8 kids when I was stationed there.

    So, yeah. The primary problem is that the Soldiers in the highest-risk demographic (young, male enlisted men) are dating and marrying a lot of trashy women. One of my Soldiers, for example, got married right before we deployed to Afghanistan. His wife immediately started stripping, and shacked up with some dude in the apartment the husband was paying for.

    That being said, Soldiers themselves enter the Army (and I assume the other services) pre-broken.

    It’s not a secret that the Soldiers who come from stable, two-parent, Christian families tend to be more resilient than the ones who don’t. But, again, no one will talk about that, because that would expose a lot of politically correct lies.

    Finally, I tried to think of all the stable marriages I saw in the Army. Almost all were officers. In other words, the kind of people who become upper-middle-class. Almost all met in college, not in the Army. Every colonel and general I met was married to his college sweetheart.

    As for enlisted men, the ones in stable marriages tended to be senior enlisted on their second marriage who learned from their mistakes and chose more wisely the second time around. The ones on their first marriage tended to be married to a girl from their home town.

    You really can’t tell if a junior enlisted man is in a stable marriage, because few, if any, have passed the Seven Year Itch.

    Anyway, your interview was a real gut punch, and a powerful reminder of how a foolish woman tears down her house with her own hands (Prov 14:1), and why it’s better to dwell in a desert land than with a contentious woman (Prov 21:19).

    That video should be required viewing for all young men, but especially for those considering military service. I’ll be watching it with my sons.

    By the way, this brings up a huge frustration of mine. I heard a lot of lies about male/female relations, and female nature in particular, growing up in church. In fact, I heard more truth about the dark side of female nature from my hedonistic NCOs when I was enlisted than I ever heard from any pastor, ever. You’ll find more truth about women at Chateau Heartiste, or at Return of Kings than you’ll ever find in church. But I don’t want to send my boys to those hedonistic hellholes to learn the truth. We need a resource written from a Biblical perspective that actually tells the truth.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Oscar says:

      This seems appropriate.

      Proverbs 7:7 And saw among the simple,
      I perceived among the youths,
      A young man devoid of understanding,
      8 Passing along the street near her corner;
      And he took the path to her house
      9 In the twilight, in the evening,
      In the black and dark night.

      10 And there a woman met him,
      With the attire of a harlot, and a crafty heart.

      11 She was loud and rebellious,
      Her feet would not stay at home.
      ……..
      22 Immediately he went after her, as an ox goes to the slaughter,
      Or as a fool to the correction of the stocks,
      23 Till an arrow struck his liver.
      As a bird hastens to the snare,
      He did not know it would cost his life.

      24 Now therefore, listen to me, my children;
      Pay attention to the words of my mouth:
      25 Do not let your heart turn aside to her ways,
      Do not stray into her paths;
      26 For she has cast down many wounded,
      And all who were slain by her were strong men.

      27 Her house is the way to hell,
      Descending to the chambers of death.

      A woman can enhance a man’s life in ways no one else can. Or, she can make it a living hell in ways no one else can.

      Liked by 1 person

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s