Redemption and Sexual Healing

It depends on whether we think sex is dirty or holy.

Readership: All

Elspeth left a lengthy comment under the post, The Motivation of Desire (2020 December 1).  I covered most of this comment in a previous post, 3 Things that make Women Tick (2020 December 11).  But there was another part of her comment which I’ll cover here.

In all sincerity, I hope to honor Elspeth by drawing attention to her testimony as a Christian wife.

There are many men who are married to women who are not regenerated, and who have no interest whatsoever in Headship, redemption, etc.  Christian men would greatly benefit from being able to identify which women can be regenerated from those who can’t or won’t.  It might help us to understand what’s going on with this.

The main point of my earlier post, The Motivation of Desire, was to identify one factor, desire, that those women who experience redemption have in common.  As far as I can see, desire, in some fashion or form, is an intrinsic vector that would lead her towards humility and carry her towards redemption. She must desire it, or else, she must desire something else that would eventually get her moving in that direction (e.g. having children, being loved and cherished by a man, etc.).  There needs to be a distinction, because there are many things a woman can desire that are a dead end in terms of her spiritual regeneration and emotional maturation (e.g. earning a degree, pursuing a career, banging Chadwick Edcad, etc.).

The same dynamic applies for men, although the respective sets of desires would be uniquely different.

Elspeth wrote,

Of course, none of the above takes into account spiritual dimensions when dealing with a Christian woman of sincere faith, and that’s where this post went wrong.  It gave a cursory nod to the power of redemption, but mostly framed everything in terms of sex.  I get why.  I am married to a red blooded guy, after all.  But either a woman can be regenerate and redeemed or she can’t.  And if she can, then she is capable of keeping her legs shut, choosing a righteous man, and learning how to grow in all the areas (emotionally, sexually, and spiritually) under his leadership.

I am not ignoring the power of God in transforming a woman or a marriage.  It’s just that this doesn’t happen “automatically” within marriage.

One might read several posts on this site and, like Elspeth, come to the conclusion that the main theme is sex.  In reaction, one might think that this is merely an emphasis on the flesh, rather than on the Spirit.  If this site only posted photos of scantily clad temptresses and stories about how to get laid, then I would have to agree.  But instead, I regard the issue of sex to be an important characteristic of human nature that we men must learn to master, so that it does not master us.

Leaving the reality of a transformed heart out of it (or subordinating it to tingles and libido) does not only Christian women a disservice, but it mostly does God a disservice.

Concerning the necessity of having a transformed heart towards regeneration, I agree. But OTOH, I also think it does God a disservice to dismiss the important role of sexuality in attaining sanctification and establishing a God honoring marriage and a God fearing family.  Sex is innately connected to sanctification and Shalom, and it cannot be overstated that both of these are extremely important to God. The reason why sexual sin is forbidden to Christians, is because it destroys both sanctification and Shalom.  We as a culture have forgotten this truth, and this ignorance has led to our utter decimation.

Look around. Because of widespread sexual immorality, women have jaded themselves and are unable to feel any visceral attraction towards the man they eventually marry.  Not only does this undermine the husband’s authority, thereby eliminating the glory of God that is associated with Headship, but it also creates enormous disillusionment, disappointment, and marital dissatisfaction, and thereby eradicates any sanctification and Shalom that would have otherwise occurred in marriage.

This has a cumulative effect on the children, who grow up in an emotionally tense, dysfunctional, or broken home, and never experience God’s glory through their parent’s relationship.

Denouncing illicit sex and abortion is not enough.  Criticizing Feminism, egalitarianism, and complementarianism is not enough.  We, as a culture, must return to God’s prerogatives of sanctification and Shalom, or else we will face His wrath and be wiped from the earth.  Look around, this is already starting to happen.

When we return to the Lord by establishing Headship in our marriages and thereby teach our children to reverence the Lord, we will receive the deep soul healing we need to be free from our profligacy and corruption (Deuteronomy 4:23-31).

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About Jack

Jack is a world traveling artist, skilled in trading ideas and information, none of which are considered too holy, too nerdy, nor too profane to hijack and twist into useful fashion. Sigma Frame Mindsets and methods for building and maintaining a masculine Frame
This entry was posted in Attraction, Building Wealth, Child Development, Choosing a Partner or Spouse, Collective Strength, Courtship and Marriage, Culture Wars, Desire, Desire, Passion, Discernment, Wisdom, Feminism, Freedom, Personal Liberty, Headship and Patriarchy, Holding Frame, Introspection, Leadership, Male Power, Maturity, Personal Growth and Development, Organization and Structure, Purpose, Relationships, Sanctification & Defilement, Sexual Authority, Stewardship, The Power of God, Vetting Women. Bookmark the permalink.

40 Responses to Redemption and Sexual Healing

  1. Scott says:

    Confession

    There are long periods of time, in even the best marriages, when sex is not occurring.

    You aren’t clicking. You’re mad at each other. The chemistry seems to have died. You planned to have a great time and the kids won’t go to sleep. Health reasons. Physical separations.

    Those are the times when your soul comes out. If you can make it through those, what is awaiting on the other side is even more bliss than you had before, but you have to wait.

    Liked by 4 people

    • cameron232 says:

      Yep.

      Morning sickness, late pregnancy, post pregnancy.

      Women have medical and other issues “down there” you really don’t want details.

      Kids won’t go to fudge to sleep. Won’t stay asleep.

      Women have babies nursing on them for large amounts of time. Hard for them to go from mom to horny housewife in 3 seconds (men get there quicker).

      Sneak away for a quicky – kids interrupt by banging on the door – “Mom!!, John won’t get out of the front bathroom and I gotta poop!!” Turn Janet Jackson music up as loud as you want you’ll still hear them.

      You get in a fight. Even worse, you get in a violent fight.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Scott says:

        Late pregnancy isn’t 100% bad.

        We’ve actually induced labor (twice) that way. And it was super fun.

        But I general it’s tricky I’ll give you that.

        Liked by 3 people

      • cameron232 says:

        Ha! Sounds like something a man made up:

        “Ummm, really honey they say that this helps induce labor – I’m just trying to help!!”

        Like

      • Sharkly says:

        Here comes the AMOG train. Choo Choo!
        Being hung like a pornstar ain’t always ideal. During pregnancy my wife’s hormones apparently overrode her intimacy issue to some degree. And she seemed to agree to sex more often. I was assured it was safe, even though I found there was noticeably even less room in there in the last trimester. However while having sex one afternoon, I apparently stretched her too far and pulled her mucus plug loose, and she went right from having an orgasm into having contractions, and our oldest son was born 3.5 weeks premature. I kind of still feel bad that my son didn’t get to gestate to term, even though the hospital people tried to reassure me that it might not have been all my fault. We took precautions for my second son, so that he wasn’t induced early.

        Flame away! LOL

        Liked by 1 person

      • cameron232 says:

        Yeah, quite a burden to bear – I gave my wife a hiatal hernia with it. Almost as bad as my being 6 foot 8 and hitting my head on the top of the door frame when I enter a room.

        Like

      • Lexet Blog says:

        According to the YouTube professors, this is because you ain’t Chad enough, though.

        Liked by 1 person

  2. Scott says:

    It’s funny you say that. She’s the one who told me prostaglandins stimulate cervical contractions

    It’s apparently science n stuff

    Liked by 3 people

    • feeriker says:

      Well, Scott, you’re fortunate that you’re married to a nurse who knows what she’s talking about in such matters. I guess that makes the process a little easier on you both? 😊

      Like

      • Scott says:

        The worst is the 4-8 weeks after the birth

        Totally unavailable and it can be really awkward trying to reconnect after that time

        Patience and love and understanding is key

        It’s tempting to take it personally but that will get you nowhere

        Liked by 2 people

    • lastmod says:

      It was also spoke about on a ‘Friends” episode almost twenty years ago

      Like

    • Oscar says:

      Maybe it works, maybe it doesn’t. It’s worth a try!

      Liked by 1 person

    • cameron232 says:

      Was definitely kidding. My wife told me the same thing about inducing contractions.

      The wives told us – they must really want us!!

      Like

      • Scott says:

        But the funny part it works a couple hours after you are done and asleep

        Then you get woken up with “um it worked.”

        Liked by 1 person

  3. Elspeth says:

    I am not ignoring the power of God in transforming a woman or a marriage. It’s just that this doesn’t happen “automatically” within marriage.

    Nope, not automatically which wasn’t what I intended to imply. Ideally it happens before the marriage and blossoms within it.

    I don’t think the theme of the blog is sex. I just happen to think that the holy and scared nature of sex means it should be broached with a level of respect and discretion that the world has stripped away from it. It’s gotten to the point where the church tries to compete with the world when it comes to titillation but somehow without titillation, LOL. It doesn’t really work.

    Scott’s opening comment is key. We live in frail human bodies. Sometimes wives (or husbands) get sick. Sometimes they are separated. Sometimes they fight, although I we honestly haven’t had a “sun go down on your anger” fight in well over a decade, possibly 15 years. We have somehow managed to stop going there, and I can’t really explain how. Well I can, but it’s off topic.

    I agree that the degenerate sexual behavior of our day has jaded these generations and harmed marriage in more ways than most married people even recognize.

    I was simply pointing out that there is hope and healing in Christ, even for women, and it often seems as if the overarching narrative is that women cannot be redeemed. I was simply taking exception to that, not on behalf of women, but on behalf of Our Savior.

    Liked by 3 people

    • thedeti says:

      I was simply pointing out that there is hope and healing in Christ, even for women, and it often seems as if the overarching narrative is that women cannot be redeemed. I was simply taking exception to that, not on behalf of women, but on behalf of Our Savior.

      We men are aware that women can be redeemed. We’re aware scripture says all can be redeemed.

      If they choose it.

      Most women, including women in Churches, including women who claim Christ, don’t choose it. But they act as if they do, everyone around them LARPs as if they do, and sells them to men as if they have. Women don’t choose it, because they don’t have to in order to get what they want temporally, and because no one requires them to do it. Certainly no man she marries is going to make her do it (with certain very, very few exceptions, most of which post in the manosphere).

      As an aside, I cannot recall ever having met any woman who are even in the same solar system as the former Manosphere Ladies’ Auxiliary – loving, ‘mirin’, submissive in all things to their husbands as unto the Lord, kind, and so extremely viscerally sexually attracted to their husbands they literally can’t see straight.

      That’s the problem. It’s not that women can’t be redeemed. It’s that most women choose not to, because they don’t have to.

      Liked by 4 people

      • feeriker says:

        That’s the problem. It’s not that women can’t be redeemed. It’s that most women choose not to, because they don’t have to.

        This is a female-specific extension of the general churchian attitude, probably a subconscious one, that if God isn’t visibly and clearly punishing them for doing something, or for neglecting to do something, then it’s not something God is concerned about.

        Liked by 2 people

  4. redpillboomer says:

    “I was simply pointing out that there is hope and healing in Christ, even for women, and it often seems as if the overarching narrative is that women cannot be redeemed.’

    Of course she can be! I know a 33 year old former CC rider who is married and has two kids, one by Chad when she was in her early twenties, and one by the husband she’s been married to for ten years now. The wife shared with me some of her past, and some of the past inside her marriage; very interesting, very insightful to say the least. In her single days she was a blonde, curvy cheerleader for a major university–need I say anymore? You get the point I’m sure; btw that’s where Chad Jr. came from, ten years ago when she was 23. Not planned, but by her own admission, one of the few times she didn’t make Chad wrap it up before entering her. Oh, forgot to mention, she was a church girl growing up, youth group, church choir, etc. etc. and because of her Christian convictions, she always made the guys put the latex on when they had their way with her. She said for some reason, it made the sex seem less ‘sinful’ to her. In fact, just to show she’s a girl of faith, she had a small tattoo made on her arm and it is a paraphrase of 1 Cor 13. She told me she doesn’t wear a two-piece at the beach because of her other tattoos, but covers them up with a one piece–ashamed of her ‘tramp stamps’ now. During her marriage, she and her both cheated on each other in the first few years. She said it was because she found out he cheated, she then went out and hopped back on Chad for a ‘get even’ ride. Fortunately, somehow, they both confessed it to each other and worked it out together….Here’s the point, and it ties back to what Elspeth said, she’s actually growing now in her faith, she and her husband are walking with the Lord, raising two kids in the faith, and she is unashamed to share her ‘mistakes’ (sinful past) with others. So, it definitely is possible. From what I’ve seen around the manosphere, this would be considered damn near impossible. I know some will say ‘it’s the exception that proves the rule,’ but I think there is more of this type of thing going on than we’re willing to give God credit for. God’s redemptive plan has room in it for all the ‘Women at the Well’s’ and ‘Mary Magdalene’s’ out there.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Oscar says:

      From what I’ve seen around the manosphere, this would be considered damn near impossible.

      Matt 19:23 Then Jesus said to His disciples, “Assuredly, I say to you that it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

      25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”

      26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

      God will have mercy on whom He will have mercy (Rom 9:15). That’s between God and the object of His mercy.

      I will continue to advise my children (of both sexes) to stay out of it, and avoid former bed-hoppers (of both sexes).

      Liked by 5 people

  5. redpillboomer says:

    “I will continue to advise my children (of both sexes) to stay out of it, and avoid former bed-hoppers (of both sexes)’ AMEN!! Yes, do that!
    “God will have mercy on whom He will have mercy (Rom 9:15). That’s between God and the object of His mercy.” Yes indeed.
    My point Oscar is that we need to allow God to do His thing with these women (and men); and not be so judgmental, overtly or covertly, like ‘they’re just done for because of their past,’ thinking. As long as they repent and move forward in their Christian growth, they have a chance with God’s grace and mercy, to actually come out with something that is relationally workable. We can’t write them off completely is all I was trying to point out. My example that I gave of the 33 year old female, albeit not necessarily the norm, shows that it is possible despite all the CC riding and other crap she did in her twenties to transform all that with God’s help.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Sharkly says:

      There are dudes who get quite attached to their sex dolls and even take them on public dates. LOL But just because a happy outcome is possible, doesn’t mean it is necessarily advisable. I don’t think God wanted us to quit executing the sexually immoral, contrary to his laws and marry them instead. While I may not be able to singlehandedly reinstitute God’s holy laws, I can at least warn my kids not to be stupid and play Captain Save-a-Ho, like I did, and for which I am currently paying the price.

      Liked by 1 person

      • cameron232 says:

        Captain Save-a-Ho.

        Confused – I thought you were the commenter who married a virgin who is cray-cray (“intimacy anorexia” or something).

        Sometimes I get the commenters confused.

        Like

      • Jack says:

        @ Cameron,
        Click on Sharkly’s icon to visit his blog. At his site, click on Whitewater Community Church.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sharkly says:

        cameron232,
        If you are interested in my story, here is a direct link:
        https://whitewatercommunitychurch.wordpress.com/2020/04/27/my-marriage/
        Jack also has a link on his sidebar to my blog: Laughing at Feminism.

        Like

      • Oscar says:

        @ Sharkly

        Dude, that’s one hellish testimony. Pastor Bill certainly sounds like an honorable man. From what I’ve observed, most “Christian” marriage counseling amounts to “everything is the husband’s fault, nothing is the wife’s fault, and the solution to every problem is for the husband to behave more like a woman.” It sounds like Pastor Bill is the rare exception to that rule.

        May the Lord vindicate you.

        Liked by 1 person

      • cameron232 says:

        Sorry for your situation – that’s awful.

        Maybe I got her mixed up with Scott’s first.

        I get different commenters’ stories confused probably because my brain always tries to assign a face to a name (or pseudonym). You have your mugshot shown there but you blurred out your face here.

        Liked by 1 person

    • Oscar says:

      @ redpillboomer

      I think we’re in agreement. I also know people who’ve been redeemed from very bad lifestyles. Biblically, we have the example of Rahab (although we get very few details).

      However, we know that they are the exception, and marrying such a person is a big risk. They need to have demonstrated years of temperance before they can even begin to be considered a relatively safe bet for marriage.

      Let’s be honest; that’s easier for a man to do than for a woman to do. Why? Because men have a longer shelf life. A man has a lot more time to rebuild his life, get it in order, and prepare for a family than a woman does.

      A man has a finite amount of time to get his life back on track, but it’s longer than the amount of time a woman has.

      Like

  6. Ame says:

    Elspeth: I agree that the degenerate sexual behavior of our day has jaded these generations and harmed marriage in more ways than most married people even recognize.

    pondering this . . . interesting the ebb and flow of flagrant sexual behavior to prudish sexual behavior through all of history . . . there is truly nothing new under the sun.

    redpillboomer
    1d ago
    “I was simply pointing out that there is hope and healing in Christ, even for women, and it often seems as if the overarching narrative is that women cannot be redeemed.’

    Of course she can be! I know a 33 year old former CC rider who is married and has two kids, one by Chad when she was in her early twenties, and one by the husband she’s been married to for ten years now.

    . . .

    she’s actually growing now in her faith, she and her husband are walking with the Lord, raising two kids in the faith, and she is unashamed to share her ‘mistakes’ (sinful past) with others. So, it definitely is possible. From what I’ve seen around the manosphere, this would be considered damn near impossible. I know some will say ‘it’s the exception that proves the rule,’ but I think there is more of this type of thing going on than we’re willing to give God credit for. God’s redemptive plan has room in it for all the ‘Women at the Well’s’ and ‘Mary Magdalene’s’ out there.

    i could be wrong b/c i have no data to support my theory, but this seems to work best when both in the couple have a ‘past’ and both understand and have experienced the depth of forgiveness. (Luke 7: 36-50 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=luke+7&version=NKJV)

    still, repentance is so critical here. she owns her stuff. it’s a part of her but no longer controls her. and she has shown a history of living a life revealing her repentance.

    i do not think men should be forced to have relationships with women who have a ‘past,’ and they should not be made to feel guilty for not wanting one. i think God would have to give a man the ability to take a woman like this and to do so well.

    when i was in college a friend went on mission trip overseas and spent some time in the red light district somewhere. she came back saying, “But for the grace of God go I.” when i think of how i grew up, in the home and environment in which i grew up, truly it’s a miracle my first Husband got my virginity.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Oscar says:

      One of the ladies that used to frequent these blogs (Sunshine Mary, I think) listed marriage categories in order of best to worst likely results.

      Virgin groom, virgin bride
      Experienced groom, virgin bride
      Experienced groom, experienced bride
      Virgin groom, experienced bride

      I’m not 100% sure about the two categories in the middle, but the two categories on the ends look accurately placed to me.

      Liked by 4 people

      • Ame says:

        Oscar – i’d agree with that list. i’ve known some in the last category, and i’ve not seen it end well. the ‘virgin groom’ seems to like that his ‘experienced bride’ is so highly desired by other men, but he doesn’t like that’s she’s slept with all of them. and the ‘experienced bride’ doesn’t understand his anger and jealousy over her past.

        sex is such a BIG deal. HUGE. and our current culture has tried to make it relative, irrelevant, and irreverent, and we’re paying the price of that.

        Liked by 2 people

      • Sharkly says:

        Ame,
        Sometimes it isn’t a jealousy over the past, so much as a frustration with their present debacle. That the whore who so thoughtlessly disrespected and defrauded her future husband, is still a whore who thoughtlessly disrespects and defrauds her husband, and her “salvation” was just another part of her fraud. She hopped straight from the CC to JC, but the only change was that Chad no longer wanted to F**k her, and she sensed that her eggs were running out. So voila! She’s born again. Bullshit! She belongs to the streets. Her conscience is seared. While God is able to redeem her soul, she is damaged. She is a horrible risk to bet your life on, and your kids lives, especially if there are better women who have evidenced their respect for their future mate by remaining unspoiled for them.
        To quote my brother from another mother, “These Hoes Ain’t Loyal”. God wanted them put to death, “So you must purge the evil from among you.” Letting the sexually immoral live to defile more people is evil and disobedient to God.

        My wife’s past was never my problem. It was always her current spirit of unfaithfulness that was the problem for me. Now her past may have continued to be a problem haunting her, but I never really knew much about it. I just knew she was treating me like sh1t, including even taunting me about her past, just to anger me with her unfaithfulness. No sane person would have said the things she said and expected it not to destroy the intimacy in the relationship, but that is exactly what she was wanting to do. That is also why she refuses to participate in any joint counselling where she could be asked about that behavior. But, if she doesn’t get help, she’ll continue to destroy my sons, as she is already doing. And so it is in their best interest that I am trying so hard to get her help. If the ungodly courts would let fathers keep their kids, which is statistically best for the kids, then I’d just let her go and be the servant of Satan that she wants to continue being.

        Never in my whole life have I given a single sh1t about what other men find attractive. That is mostly a female desire, to want others to find your mate attractive. To me that is just a risk. While I don’t want them to find her disgustingly ugly, to the point of thinking poorly of me, that is as far as that desire goes. I have no interest in marketing my wife. To me it was a big negative that my wife was not a virgin, but apparently not big enough to keep me from foolishly marrying her at that time. I was blue-pill brainwashed then.

        Liked by 1 person

      • cameron232 says:

        This is an interesting comment that deserves attention. My attempt:

        1. Virgin groom, virgin bride –
          The best. No sexual (men) or emotional (women) jealousy on either side. No previous lovers to compare to (for either side). No pair bonding with previous man for the bride. No alpha widow. Also these couples who hold out are more likely to be religious and K-strategists by nature.
        2. Experienced groom, virgin bride
          3rd worst. No sexual jealousy from the man. No female pair-bonding or alpha widows. Some emotional jealousy (women). The man is more likely to cheat than virgin groom (probably higher SMV on average, more r-strategist, more likely to be addicted for fornication & variety).

        3. Experienced groom, experienced bride
          2nd worst. The opposite of 1 except that the man can at least rationalize that he was guilty of fornication too which probably makes him softer on the woman. Also, man more likely to be high SMV compared to 1 & 4 (virgin groom) both by objective standards and in his wife’s eyes because other women wanted him.

        4. Virgin groom, experienced bride
          The worst -doesn’t even have the pluses of 3. More likely to be low SMV male (either objectively and/or in his wife’s eyes). Man can’t rationalize that he “did it to”, or “got to get it out of his system” ,etc.
          Most likely to lead to what Dalrock has pointed out. Years later the man’s more likely to think “it was her turn when she was young with high SMV. Now that my SMV has risen, it’s my turn. Why should the rules favor women (and high SMV males).”

        I referred to 2, 3, and 4 as “worst” because they’re all turd sandwiches.

        Liked by 2 people

  7. Ame says:

    Sharkly – My wife’s past was never my problem. It was always her current spirit of unfaithfulness that was the problem for me. Now her past may have continued to be a problem haunting her, but I never really knew much about it.

    all of her past has continuously haunted her. rather than dealing with it, she lives in denial and delusion and suppression, which dictated her behavior, and therefore made it your problem.

    imo, unless she was sexually abused, she was spiritually bonded (married by God) with the first guy she had sex with. she has tried to believe the feminist/cultural lies, and b/c it’s not possible to believe the lies with a clear, healthy conscience, she has devolved to where she is now and has been for most of her life.

    the truth would set her free, but getting free of all the chains that bind her will be painful. few choose the path of freedom unless living in the hell they are in now becomes painful enough to motivate them to go thru the pain and hell of ‘recovery.’ when i’ve prayed for her, this is what i’ve prayed for – that she would get to this place, turn from her wicked ways, face her truth, seek repentance, and choose the painful path of healing.

    But, if she doesn’t get help, she’ll continue to destroy my sons, as she is already doing.

    we live the short story; God lives the long story.

    your sons have something powerful in their corner; they have you … a father who loves God with his whole heart and soul and mind and who is willing to fight for them. fight on your knees for our battle is not against flesh and blood. never give up praying for them. the story you’re fighting for is the long story – the story and war for their hearts and souls. and God longs to win that one. don’t ever believe that your role is non-essential. don’t ever believe the little things you do aren’t important. don’t ever believe that standing for truth in the power of Jesus the Christ doesn’t make a powerful difference in their lives. it does. and it always will, regardless of how they react or present. they need your strength more than they need air to breathe. i’m continuously stunned at how powerful i am to my daughters … whenever we talk about such things they always end with, “But, Mom, we had you.” be that one they can always say, “But, Dad, we had you.” let them know you are praying for them. let them know you love them. when they’re in their darkest places, they’ll be begging God to please let their Daddy be praying for them right at that moment. record it if you can and are willing. write out those prayers with dates and times. they can look back someday and see the power of Holy God thru you.

    Liked by 2 people

    • cameron232 says:

      “imo, unless she was sexually abused, she was spiritually bonded (married by God) with the first guy she had sex with. ”

      That is the Martin Madan/Artisinal Toad hypothesis and is wrong (at least Madan had good intentions). If coitus=marriage then rape would be marriage. If the standard is co-consent to coitus, that doesn’t work either. Consent to carnal relations/fornication isn’t consent to marriage. Consent to marriage is consent to marriage, specifically God’s definition.

      Virtually no one in Church history has believed this Madan/AT idea. Christian marriage has always been based on the exchange of consent to marriage, often symbolized by the exchange of some token.

      If anyone tells you different, they are repeating internet fairytales.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Ame says:

        Cameron, i know it’s controversial, which is why i prefaced with ‘imo.’

        i doubt, though, that there’d be little controversy over the fact that sex changes us women … it takes something from us – either by force or voluntarily, and it leaves something with us whether that is something we want or don’t want. not simply body fluids, although that’s part of it, but also emotional and psychological, too. this exchange happens with each man a woman has sex with.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Sharkly says:

        1 Corinthians 6:15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16 Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, “The two will become one flesh.”

        cameron232,
        There is an actual physical-world bond that occurs, according to God’s word. While you might not call it a marriage bond, it is a bondage nonetheless. And later in the same chapter it says that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, implying that polluting your body through sexual immorality also damages your spiritual life and robs God of glory due from you, as a man, bodily.

        1 Corinthians 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit. 18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body. 19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s.

        The part about them being bonded according to God’s decree is not an internet fairytale.

        While my wife was probably not an adult when she first had sex with whomever, nor were they probably consenting to marriage, yet there still was a union formed that is both recognized and forbade by God, and then with every other guy after that, as well, there was an additional union.

        I was told that one guy had all three sisters, and that the older two sisters were supposedly mad at him for “taking” their youngest sister’s virginity. Frickin’ Jerry Springer filth family! I can’t believe I had been coached by evil pastorbaters to “man-up and marry a Ho”, I don’t recall Jesus doing that. Oh that’s right, because He mustn’t be defiled by women,(Revelation 14:4) if he was going to be the undefiled Lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world. He took our sin in His undefiled body upon the cross. Thus it was necessary for the Christ to have been an undefiled virgin, a spotless Lamb, not already united as one flesh with a defiler who should rightly be shamefaced because of it.(1 Timothy 2:9-10) Sorry, I’m going off on a tangent now. Anyhow, women need to be taken off of the pedestal so that their “saviors” can get back up there and be reverenced,(Ephesians 5:33) elevated to where the image and glory of God alone belongs. Women, who are only the glory of men are categorically to be held in less regard than men.

        Ephesians 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. 24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

        A husband also takes on all of his wife’s defilement into his body, as they become one flesh, “Lord, I feel it!”, and like the savior, not only are we to cleanse our wives with daily washing with the word of God, but, as the image of Christ, we are to take up and bear our crosses daily, as we suffer because of her. Ladies should not be haughty, especially not to their lords, since he, like Christ, is also a guardian of her soul and a covering over her.

        What evil rot we have been taught!

        Liked by 1 person

      • cameron232 says:

        I absolutely believe that sex matters and changes people, more so the woman. I am on record here as suggesting that their may even be something to the UFO-conspiracy-theory idea of telegony.

        Definitely not suggesting man up and marry those ho’s.

        Liked by 2 people

    • Sharkly says:

      Ame,
      Thank you for praying for my marriage. My sons could sure use a miracle right about now.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Ame says:

        you’re welcome. there are five ‘wayward’ wives of men i’ve met out here that i pray for, and yours is one of them.

        and . . .

        i know, Sharkly, i really, really do know.

        i can promise you what the Bible says is true … that God IS … that He will never, ever, ever leave you or your sons … that He is Redeemer, and i don’t know how or when, but He will redeem all of this for His purposes and His glory in His time, and for the good of you and your sons.

        i can pretty much guarantee that won’t look anything like what you hope or dream or cry out to God for. i can pretty much guarantee it will all be on a timeline you cannot imagine (and likely wouldn’t ask for). and i can pretty much guarantee it will be painful – if not for the rest of your life, then for a very long time.

        it broke me. it crushed me. it still tries. it’s still painful. but God is still God, and God is still good, and He will continue to be God, and will continue to be good, for eternity. they say we have to keep holding on to God, but when there’s nothing left, and we can’t hold on anymore, we find that He is still there, holding onto us. we can’t always feel it, but we can choose to believe it.

        Liked by 2 people

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