3 Things that make Women Tick

Elspeth gives us the scoop on the female psyche.

Readership: All

Elspeth left a lengthy comment under the post, The Motivation of Desire (2020 December 1).  I believe Elspeth is the real thing, so I want to go over her comments here, and see if we can glean any further insights.

Elspeth wrote,

The notion that a woman who works to look good to men is submissive and demure?  That is outlandish on its face.  Demureness can be manufactured and it’s entirely possible for a woman to be all of those things on the surface but underneath it all is something that will suck a man’s soul dry.

To be clear, I did not say that a woman who works to look good to men is submissive and demure.  I said that a woman who works to look good to men and who is also (truly) submissive and demure is respectful of male authority.  Maybe a better way to say this is that if a woman is respectful of male authority, then she will show it by being submissive and demure, and making herself attractive.  I also mentioned that this is an exceedingly rare combination.  It’s also difficult for men to discern this from the fakers.

This may fall on deaf ears, but I’m going to tell you what makes women tick, hopefully in descending order.  I’ve been married since I was 22 years old (26+ years now), so my knowledge is based on my experience (both when single and married) and the observation of the women around me, both married and single.

Pottery- Wheel Throwing with Nita Terrell - Shelby County Arts Council

1. Social/Familial Acceptance

If a woman has a close knit family with high standards and a father she emotionally loves and feels a strong aversion to disappointing, she’s less likely to get into mischief.  Having a “good dad” isn’t the same thing as having a dad she truly doesn’t want to disappoint.

I deeply respected my dad for the way he worked hard to raise all of us as a widower, but the emotional connection wasn’t there, and my husband was able to –quite easily – capture my heart away from any sense of family duty.  Our girls have an emotional heart connection with their dad; they take him out and do fun stuff with him just because.  They also have a healthy reverential respect for him.  They think in terms of “Secret Agent Man’s daughters don’t do this or that”.  It never occurred to me to spend that kind of time with my father as a young adult.  I was acutely aware, however, of how much I had embarrassed him.

If she doesn’t have that kind of high accountability/close knit family relationship (few young women do), then she pulls out all the stops to be accepted in her peer group; whatever that is and whatever that looks like.  Humans are social creatures, and women are the most social of all creatures.  And women want to be liked and accepted (envied may be even better).

2. Men and Sexual Attractiveness

The younger a woman is, the more likely her choice of mate is determined by what you refer to as tingles.  It just so happens that under the age of say, 27, her friends will be totally and completely supportive of her slumming around with a guy heading nowhere fast so long as he’s hot, and so long as she’s still doing all the stuff (grad school, career advancement, etc.).

Elspeth Owen | Contemporary ceramics, Pottery, Handmade pottery

3. The Fantasy Life / Lifestyle

I was raised by a Silent father (no mother first decade of life), so I never really entertained that kind of fantasy life, but it is rampant today, and the influence is powerful.  Girls make all kinds of nonsensical decisions if it feeds the imaginary life she’s pined for.  It doesn’t help that we’re all being told ad nauseum to “follow our dreams”.  Never, EVER underestimate the power of the narrative that plays in the heads of the average woman.  Those narratives include travel (what IS it with the travel stuff?), a fabulous job that doesn’t feel like work (it’s like we’ve all forgotten that it’s called work for a reason), and a 6’+ man that is the best of everything both male and female.

Great sex can throw a monkey wrench in all that, but it won’t last long if she notices that the dream is slipping from her grasp.  If the guy doesn’t tick ALL the boxes, it won’t be enough.  She’ll be out; first emotionally, then sexually, then the rest of her.  No amount of anything is going to make a woman happy with a man whom she sees as the one thing that kept her from the fabulousness of what she was meant to be.  And to her, it WILL be his fault, no matter how good looking or how much sexual prowess he has.  If he has money, he might be forgiven, because at least she can show that off.  But sans wealth, all bets are off, and most men are not wealthy.

I was not surprised to read points 1 and 2, but I was shucked by what Elspeth wrote in the last paragraph – that the mental narrative (AKA solipsism, which is a form of sin) trumps all else.  One question I have at this point is, why are a woman’s solipsistic dreams so much more important than submitting to a fantastic man who loves her?  Not even sexual bonding is enough to get her to tune into her God ordained purpose as a woman?  WTH???  And no matter how good her life might be, fantasy land will always be “better”.

Actually, this is a question that strikes to the core of mankind’s relationship to God.  Why does man reject the promises of God in favor of his vain imaginings of solipsistic sin?

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About Jack

Jack is a world traveling artist, skilled in trading ideas and information, none of which are considered too holy, too nerdy, nor too profane to hijack and twist into useful fashion. Sigma Frame Mindsets and methods for building and maintaining a masculine Frame
This entry was posted in Female Power, Models of Success, Relationships, Self-Concept, Solipsism, Vetting Women. Bookmark the permalink.

45 Responses to 3 Things that make Women Tick

  1. Weka says:

    Elspeth is the real deal, and she’s describing what is there.

    Not what should be there. The idea of a fantasy life and ‘havonf it all’s is a lie from the pit, and she knows that.

    But most women do not.

    Liked by 2 people

  2. cameron232 says:

    My best guess is that women (for reasons largely based on socio-biological reasons) tend to want it all. More precisely, their ideal involves a diverse array of male traits that are rare in a single man, let alone one they can get. What they want, romantically, can only be found in fantasy land. Note that their travel fantasies frequently involve meeting mysterious, ideal male.

    Mens’ wants are simpler. They want the hottest chick they can get who isn’t a pain in the arse.

    Men have a romantic fantasy land (porn) which simply involves sex with a really hot chick.

    Like

    • Jack says:

      @ Cameron,
      I already knew women are prone to romance fantasies like men are drawn to p0rn, but Elspeth’s description extends this fantasy into the everyday realm of existence. I never imagined that women could be so megalomaniacal.

      Liked by 2 people

      • cameron232 says:

        Jack,

        Yes, I guess I realized you were broadening the subject and I was covering familiar ground. I guess my thought was that these fantasies of travel and career often involve romantic yearning as part of the fantasy- the perfect guy she meets at work that will appreciate her high powered career. THe exotic, perfect man she will meet while seeing the world.

        Maybe that’s too Freudian – everything’s psycho-sexual.

        Elspeth’s description though, seems to involve women whose men aren’t ticking all the boxes – they want more in men.

        Liked by 1 person

  3. danielvincent23 says:

    If what she said in the last paragraph is really true then it’s better not to get married.

    Liked by 3 people

    • feeriker says:

      It wouldn’t be so bad if the social and religious institutions of times past (i.e., “The Patriarchy”) that kept women’s worst impulses and behaviors in check were still functioning. Unfortunately, those are all gone now. We all know that the church might as well be non-existent in terms of either its ability or its willingness to enforce any kind of biblical discipline over its female members. Thus the lack of any meaningful behavioral differences between Christian women and unbelievers. That being a given, yes, marriage even to the average self-professed “Christian” woman presents an almost unacceptable risk.

      Liked by 2 people

  4. redpillboomer says:

    “…but it won’t last long if she notices that the dream is slipping from her grasp. If the guy doesn’t tick ALL the boxes, it won’t be enough.” This in a nutshell is the core of the problem with our young women. No man can tick ALL of the boxes ALL of the time to maintain her DREAM lifestyle indefinitely, aka the trope ‘Living the Dream.’ Even the females who seem to land this lifestyle for a short season, i.e. the women who land a so-called top tier 1% Alpha male, many (the majority?) of these relationships end up imploding at some point down the line. Satan has woven such a narrative of deception within the females of our society (males too, but that is a different subject for a different post), that it takes something ‘miraculous’ to pull them out of this wild and crazy DREAM life thing BEFORE reality comes brutally calling: High N-Count, inability to pair bond, declining SMV/MMV>The Wall>Declining Fertility>No ‘good’ man willing to commit to her>Post-Wall>Only what she considers ‘low value males,’ and men with considerable baggage available to marry her (maybe)>Tight resources due to a profligate lifestyle during her twenties with little savings (travel expenses, educational debt, etc) and so forth. We’ve gotten so far from the Biblical model of marriage in today’s society, heck even the former western cultural model, Marriage 1.0 as it is sometimes referred to, that it appears were reaching/already reached/well surpassed the point of no return. Sad state of affairs, and not good for society as a whole.

    Liked by 4 people

  5. cameron232 says:

    OT but too good not to share. Red pill in Jane Austen’s Pride and Prejudice. So blatant.

    https://neurotoxinweb.wordpress.com/2020/11/29/red-pill-in-fiction-classics-edition-pride-and-prejudice/

    This is NOT a Christian site but the post isn’t super-naughty.

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Elspeth says:

    One question I have at this point is, why are a woman’s solipsistic dreams so much more important than submitting to a fantastic man who loves her? Not even sexual bonding is enough to get her to tune into her God ordained purpose as a woman? WTH??? And no matter how good her life might be, fantasy land will always be “better”.

    It’s the parents’ fault. Seriously. Believe it or not, I actually DO know Christian parents who are raising their daughters to have measured, realistic expectations about what it means to live a good, satisfying life. They are sadly, few and far between, but they exist.

    As for me, all credit to my dad, who intentionally (but also unintentionally through the things we suffered as a family), set his kids up to recognize that a peaceful life, where our needs are met, and that is filled with love, is a blessed thing that few people are able to enjoy and appreciate.

    Liked by 7 people

    • Oscar says:

      As for me, all credit to my dad, who intentionally (but also unintentionally through the things we suffered as a family), set his kids up to recognize that a peaceful life, where our needs are met, and that is filled with love, is a blessed thing that few people are able to enjoy and appreciate.

      That’s a lesson I’ve tried to teach my children. We’ll soon see how well I’ve done.

      Liked by 6 people

  7. Elspeth says:

    I should also add that my original comment that jack has shared, was written in the context of women in general because the post was written with respect to women in the larger culture, not Christian women specifically.

    For a whole host of reasons, even women raised in religious households are raised with a certain expectation of a life filled with all the pleasurable things this world has to offer, and little suffering or sacrifice. Comfort is the god of our age.

    However, Christian women, born again by the grace of God, even with all our imperfections, can -and sometimes do- rise to the standard of a faithful, committed, content wife who understands that the world’s fantasies are lies.

    Liked by 4 people

    • thedeti says:

      However, Christian women, born again by the grace of God, even with all our imperfections, can -and sometimes do- rise to the standard of a faithful, committed, content wife who understands that the world’s fantasies are lies.

      But, not a sexually attracted wife. Not a hard, viscerally sexually attracted wife.

      This is great for her, because she is “content”. Not so great for her husband, because despite her contentment, he still doesn’t have a wife who REALLY wants him – she wants the security and money he provides.

      Sure, she is “faithful” (in body, probably not in heart). She’s “committed” insofar as she remains legally married to him. She’s “content” in that she’s not chomping at the bit to get out of her marriage and have sex with men she really wants. She has security, money, and what she needs.

      Where does what the man wants and needs fit into all this? Oh, yeah, that’s right, it doesn’t.

      Great for her. Crappy for him.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Jack says:

        @ Deti,
        Elspeth has this visceral kind of attraction to her husband. For reference…
        https://deepstrength.wordpress.com/2020/06/27/jumping-back-to-meet-cute-scenarios/#comment-18765

        Like

      • Elspeth says:

        For the record, and this is my last comment, when I describe a wife as faithful, committed, and content that assumes the husband’s needs are being noted. honored, and satisfied. I don’t just mean staying legally married without cheating.

        Liked by 1 person

      • thedeti says:

        Jack: I know Elspeth has that kind of visceral attraction for her husband.

        Most women do not.

        That’s my point. And that’s the problem. Because most women did have that kind of visceral attraction for at least one man before they got married- and had sex with him/them. It’s just that most of those women couldn’t get one of those men to commit and offer marriage. And it creates enormous disillusionment, disappointment and marital dissatisfaction.

        I keep saying this.. I don’t know how much clearer I can say it.

        Liked by 4 people

      • Jack says:

        @ Deti,
        Point taken, and I agree. Most women, even Christians, spill all their beans outside of marriage. The thing that makes this problem even worse is that men are totally clueless about how female sexuality works.
        BTW, your comments are worthy of a separate post.

        Liked by 2 people

      • cameron232 says:

        @deti,
        I apologize ahead of time if I misunderstand you.

        IMO a husband is not entitled to a wife who performs like a pornstar. He should be contented with regular (as in frequent but also as in “normal”) sex from his wife. No, not coldfish, I’m doing this resentfully sex. But he isn’t entitled to sex that somehow guarantees her hard visceral attraction so that he somehow knows she’s faithful in heart (how would you ever know this about your spouse – do you suppose there aren’t men who are fantasizing about the young secretary at work when their doing the deed with their middle aged wife).

        We don’t know how “hard-viscerally-attracted” virgins would be to their husbands – in general I mean under modern conditions. When most brides were virgins, I doubt they were all burning with intense desire for hubby.

        I don’t know what you’re demanding for men. Virgin brides as the norm? Sure that’s God’s will and good for men and women.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Jack says:

        @ Cameron,
        P0rnstars are a cheap imitation of real sexual passion.
        This post might explain why this passion is missing from p0rnstars and why it should be characteristic of a young wife.
        https://sigmaframe.wordpress.com/2019/06/07/the-parable-of-the-pressure-cooker/

        Like

      • thedeti says:

        This might go into moderation, I don’t know.

        Cameron

        I’m not saying a man is entitled to a p0rnstar. A man is not “entitled” to anything other than regular, frequent sex at reasonable intervals. What’s necessary for that, in modern day America and for many years prior, is that if he’s to get that, it must be from a woman who actually wants to be there and actually wants to have that sex with him and actually wants to give it to him, enthusiastically, and not grudgingly or resentfully.

        The only way he’s going to get that sex or get a woman to stay with him is if he finds one who is like Elspeth – hard, viscerally sexually attracted to him. Most men cannot get that. They just don’t inspire those feelings in women.

        That’s necessary now, because anything less than hard visceral sexual attraction causes the woman to resent him, begrudge him, and eventually, leave, cheat, or treat him poorly. That’s so, because that woman had sex with men she WAS hard viscerally sexually attracted to, but those men aren’t her husband, and that makes her very, very angry and resentful. She has those emotions because she couldn’t get commitment from any of those men, and she “had to settle” for her husband. Deep down she knows that her husband is a reflection of her true worth and value as a woman, that that worth and value is not as high as she thought it was or should be, and that really makes her angry.

        Good enough to pump and dump, not good enough to commit to. Good enough to sex, not good enough to marry. And she knows it, and she takes her anger and resentment out on her husband who is the living breathing reminder every day of her life that she wasn’t good enough and he’s the best she could do.

        There are two ways to avoid that:

        1) A return to tight controls on women’s sexuality, hard slut shaming, hard monogamy, and severe cultural and societal sanctions against female promiscuity so as to limit her sexual experiences to men who actually will commit to her; and

        2) The woman must be hard viscerally sexually attracted to her husband.

        The first option is not going to happen barring cataclysmic social, economic, political and cultural upheaval. Nothing less than a complete and total rollback of the sexual revolution and a return to Marriage 1.0 will do that.

        And that is not going to happen in our lifetimes, our children’s lifetimes, and probably not our grandchildren’s lifetimes.

        So, option 2 is it. If you want a marriage that is successful from the man’s point of view, you have to have option 2. Like Scott and Mychael. Like SAM and Elspeth. Like Sunshine Mary and HHG (blast from the past). If you don’t have that, your marriage will almost certainly go into failure.

        And most men cannot have that. They can’t get that. They can’t attract a woman who will give them that. So the better option for most men now is not to marry at all.

        Liked by 4 people

      • thedeti says:

        Cameron

        Sex doesn’t guarantee hard visceral sexual attraction. It’s the other way around: Hard visceral sexual attraction is conducive to and usually causes good, frequent, enthusiastic sex.

        A man will be contented with regular frequent sex. The problem is that unless she is hard viscerally attracted to him, she won’t do it. She won’t give it to him unless she really really really WANTS to, and she doesn’t with him. She’s been given all kinds of cultural messages from everywhere that she doesn’t have to do anything she doesn’t want to do, and he’s not entitled to sex, and husbands aren’t entitled to sex from wives. The only way to guarantee you have a woman who really wants to is to get one who’s hard viscerally sexually attracted.

        I wouldn’t care so much that she’s faithful in heart as long as she’s doing the deed regularly and enthusiastically. No one is completely truly faithful in heart. But if she does fantasize about other men, she better never tell him that or let on that that’s the case. If she does, she will crush him and destroy him.

        In this particular context, I don’t care about “but men do it too!”. I don’t care what men do or don’t do. I don’t care that men fantasize about their secretaries. Men can do that AND provide for their wives AND have enthusiastic sex with their wives. It’s women who seem to be unable to walk and chew gum at the same time here. It’s women who seem to be unable to let it go when it comes to having sex with their less attractive husbands after having had hot fun sex with much more attractive men. It seems to be women who can’t let those experiences go. It seems to be women who can’t keep those prior sexual experiences from injuring and destroying their marriages, and themselves in the process.

        Men aren’t really the problem here. The only factor about men here is that a lot of them just aren’t very sexually attractive. But, if that’s the case, these women KNEW that BEFORE they married these men. If they weren’t sexually attracted to these men, they should not have married those men.

        I know that for women, the purpose of marriage is making babies and nesting and having a family. But dammit, they have to know that the purpose of marriage for men is to get sex, and if they don’t know that, then they’re not paying attention. Women should be refusing marriage proposals unless they are hard viscerally sexually attracted. Women should not be marrying men unless they are so sexually attracted to those men they can’t see straight.

        Another issue here is that women also fake it. They feign sexual attraction for men so they can extract commitment. They get the ring and the march down the aisle, and then she’s got him locked in. She got what she wanted: Commitment and marriage from a man, any man. Then immediately after the wedding, they cut their husbands off sexually and send him to the grindstone to start his job providing as a beta bucks. The only reason she married him was to get commitment and an income stream for the family she wants.

        When most brides were virgins, no, a lot of them probably didn’t burn with sexual passion. But they didn’t have any other frame of reference. They were realistic about their options.
        They were looking for husbands in a much smaller pool than now, and they weren’t sleeping with anywhere from 5 to 30 men or more before their weddings.

        Most virgin brides never even got to go on a date with Chadwick Throckmorton IV or Frank Fratboy or Alpha McGorgeous or Harley McBadboy, much less have sex with any of them. Most virgin brides got, at most, a look or two or some conversation from those men. Most of the time, Dad and brothers and uncles kept those men away from their girls. Most moms, sisters and aunties told their girls

        “you better get realistic right now about who is going to take you, because you don’t have forever to find a man and make your choice. The longer you wait, the slimmer the pickings get. Chadwick and Frank and Alpha and Harley are NOT going to pick you and Dad and Uncles are not going to approve of you picking one of them. The most you’ll get from Chadwick, Frank, Alpha or Harley is your skirt around your neck in the back seat of a ’39 Ford, and an “accident” where you’ll have to be sent “away” for about 8 weeks, 7 to 8 months from now, and your dad getting his shotgun out.

        “So you best get with the program here, get realistic, and start taking this seriously if you want to get married.”

        Today, most women have had sex during their lifetimes with at least one of those men. Most women thumbed their noses at mom (and dad, if mom is still married to him or was ever married to him), dated and had sex with whoever she wanted, used their birth control to avoid any oopsies, and did anything else they wanted.

        No, I don’t expect virgin brides for most men. It’s not going to happen.

        Liked by 4 people

      • Oscar says:

        Why, Mr. Deti, I do believe you’ve been taking notes from Ms. Charlotte Lucas.

        Like

      • thedeti says:

        Another thing is that up to about 1960, most women were marrying men they had grown up with, or they lived in the same geographic region. They met and befriended and dated these men through organic social circles: School, churches, entry level jobs, other friends. They dated men who lived in the next town over or at most 20 to 30 miles away, a short car ride. They dated and married men they had known since high school and in extended social circles. They dated and married men they met and got to know through other friends.

        If she went to college and was still unmarried, chances are she would pair off with a guy in college and they would stay together until they graduated, then they would get engaged, get jobs in the same locale, and get married. Or, she graduated college and went back home, and married a guy she knew from back home.

        The way you met each other was through actually having real time, in person social interaction with the world and the humans in it. By being together – talking, telling stories, drinking, eating, partying together, getting drunk together, going to class together, riding home from college together. It required some modicum of social skill. You could not depend on a smartphone or an app or pixels. You had to rely on your wit, your demeanor, your physical presence, your voice, and your ability to carry on a conversation and make small talk.

        Through doing that, you paired off with people you had known and had known you since you were about 9 years old, and could figure out who is good for you and who’s not. You learned who you liked and who you didn’t like, what attracted you and what didn’t. If you had trouble with it, other people helped you with it, usually family members, but sometimes trusted friends. They would do that by introducing you to friends, or friends of friends, and giving you social proof by impliedly vouching for you, in person, using hands and body and voice and conversation.

        I rambled on, but the point is that everyone was moving in a much smaller pool of available men and women. Your choices were limited. Your friends, your social and professional circles, and your social wit and ability put boundaries on your choices. Those things also helped everyone by putting together suitable people through help from others or organic social connection. It also helped by putting together people who had known each other a long time and thus had common bonds of custom, community, culture, and regional social commonalities.

        Liked by 3 people

      • cameron232 says:

        @thedeti,

        Lots of good points you make. We tend see these things through our own experiences. Maybe I just got very lucky and as a result am naive. I have never had a problem, from the beginning with regular enthusiastic sex. And I guarantee you I am not in the top 20% or whatever – just a very average guy.

        Liked by 2 people

  8. thedeti says:

    One question I have at this point is, why are a woman’s solipsistic dreams so much more important than submitting to a fantastic man who loves her? Not even sexual bonding is enough to get her to tune into her God ordained purpose as a woman? WTH??? And no matter how good her life might be, fantasy land will always be “better”.

    Elspeth is correct that it is the parents’ fault. It’s also the ambient feminism that everyone swims in. Modern Western culture IS feminism. Everyone and everything is feminist. Even Christian women are feminists who are against abortion.

    All women, and I mean ALL women, born after about 1960 are marinated in feminism and are feminists. All women in the US over the age of 25 are feminists, and I don’t care what anyone says to the contrary because it’s not true. EVERY man who has gotten married in the last 40 years married a feminist.

    The last reason is the overarching dominant cultural narrative and “life script” that Novaseeker has explicated so well and better than I can. The narrative is basically this:

    “Daughter, you can’t ever depend on a man and you can’t ever trust a man. Think about the D’s: Divorce, death, disability. What if he leaves you, cheats on you, dies on you, or becomes a cripple? You need a career so you can stand on your own two feet if you have to. You need college. You need job training. You need to earn your own money. You need to compete on equal footing with men. You are equal to men in every way, you can do anything a man can do. You don’t have to take any crap from a man and you sure as hell don’t have to “submit” to him. Any man you marry will be a completely 50/50 equal partner with you and you MUST insist on that.

    “In the meantime before you get married, it’s not really OK to have sex, but you’re going to anyway, so just make sure that if you do, you do it with men you love or at least like a lot. Or, if you’re a nonChristian, you can have all the sex you want with as many different men as you want and there will still be hot, attractive, resources-rich men waiting for you when you’re done with that.”

    The ideal “life script” is:

    Education, bachelor’s degree or extensive job training, move to a population center, get job, live alone or with roommates who are doing the same thing you’re doing. Advance in career, get competent or even proficient. Travel to fun and exotic tropical destinations. Have fun. Make some frivolous purchases like $800 Louis Vuitton handbags. Keep working. Probably get master’s degree. Change job if necessary. All your friends and every woman you know around your age is doing this.

    During all of the above, you are dating both for fun and in the hopes of meeting a marriageable man. You are having sex with most of those men. Some are false starts. Some are short term, no more than 3-6 months. Some are long term. Again: All your friends and every woman you know around your age is doing this.

    The above 2 grafs take her out to at least age 25, and many times to the late 20s. (It is alleged by some that many, most, women meet the man they will marry by age 23, and they then marry in their late 20s because the reported average age from relationship start to marriage is 4.9 years. This doesn’t take into account though that female average age at first marriage is 28 and creeping upwards.)

    Phase 2: Meet man who you will marry. Get married in equal partnership marriage. Have one child, at most two. Options to stay home, work part time/flex time, or continue full time. Your husband also works and does significant chores around the house and takes the stress off you, as he’s expected to because you are his equal in every significant way. It’s not your job to do most of the housework and child rearing- you’re to do only half of it, and he’s to do the other half (that you decide he needs to do).

    So that’s why a woman’s solipsistic dreams are more important than submitting to a fantastic man who loves her:

    1) Her “dreams” (or, her life survival) predominate over marriage and everything else until she’s at least in her early 20s. During the time when she’s most attractive and most able to secure “a fantastic man who loves her”, she is spending that time getting educated and job trained so she can do what mom and dad and everyone else told her – Don’t ever be in a position where you have to depend on a man. Instead of looking for a man to take care of survival, she’s doing it herself and not nearly as well as a man can.

    2) She’s entitled to “have fun” before she gets married. Travel, make and spend money. Date (i.e. have sex with) attractive men and maybe one will commit. Dating = sex. Everyone is doing this. Your parents, church and pastors usually know this but look the other way.

    3) The way you find a husband is you find attractive men, have sex with them within 3 dates, and then find out if there’s enough compatibility there to keep dating. Then hopefully you get exclusive. Then hopefully, when everything is right, you get married. But EVERYTHING must be in place: His career, her career, sufficient money, a decent place to live, access to transportation and culture. She must also be satisfied she has acquired enough life experience that she is satisfying her YOLO needs and FOMO fears, and she must do this before she agrees to marriage.

    4) Submission is almost completely omitted from the narrative. Women are not to submit to men. A woman dating a man is not to take the submissive position. A wife is not to submit to her husband, or if she does, she submits only when she wants to and only when she approves of the husband’s conduct. She has everyone’s permission and approval to approach men and marriage this way – even from her church and her pastors, and certainly from her mother, and almost always from her father (if she has one) Absolutely no one will tell her she is to submit to her husband “in all things, as unto the Lord” – not even her church, not even her pastors. Submission to a man equals dependence on him, and remember – she cannot be in a position where she has to depend on a man.

    Liked by 4 people

    • thedeti says:

      All women are doing this. Including Christian women. We know this because the church has now been almost completely converged and subsumed into the ambient dominant feminist culture.

      Liked by 4 people

    • feeriker says:

      Even Christian women are feminists who are against abortion.

      They’re not even consistantly and reliably anti-abortion. Let THEM, or one of their daughters, get pregnant with an “oopsie!” baby, and just watch the hamster wheels spurt flames searching for that loophole to justify an abortion. I’ve seen it happen –more than once– in evangelical congregations.

      All women, and I mean ALL women, born after about 1960 are marinated in feminism and are feminists.

      Move that date back 20 years earlier, and you’ve nailed the beginning of the window, starting with 2WF.

      “Daughter, you can’t ever depend on a man and you can’t ever trust a man. Think about the D’s: Divorce, death, disability. What if he leaves you, cheats on you, dies on you, or becomes a cripple? You need a career so you can stand on your own two feet if you have to. AND DON’T JUST TRUST GOD TO MEET YOUR NEEDS AND BLESS YOUR MARRIAGE, EITHER.
      REMEMBER THAT GOD HELPS THOSE WHO HELPS THEMSELVES!
      You need college. You need job training. You need to earn your own money. You need to compete on equal footing with men. You are equal to men in every way, you can do anything a man can do. You don’t have to take any crap from a man and you sure as hell don’t have to “submit” to him. Any man you marry will be a completely 50/50 equal partner with you and you MUST insist on that.”

      You left something out. I fixed it for you.

      Submission is almost completely omitted from the narrative. Women are not to submit to men

      She’s “flipped God the bird” in every other aspect of her life, so why not in this, too?

      Liked by 3 people

    • redpillboomer says:

      Very solid points you made above thedeti! Really sound observations of the current reality with women in the western hemisphere, Australia and New Zealand. Unfortunately, it seems to also be working it’s way through other cultural regions around the world at vary speeds and paces.

      Liked by 3 people

      • Jack says:

        @ RedPillBoomer,
        It seems that the Fem-bug is infecting every democratic society, including strongly traditional, patriarchal societies like India, Singapore, and Taiwan.

        Liked by 1 person

  9. redpillboomer says:

    “It required some modicum of social skill. You could not depend on a smartphone or an app or pixels. You had to rely on your wit, your demeanor, your physical presence, your voice, and your ability to carry on a conversation and make small talk.”

    Yes, the pre-Internet era. I learned through my twenties that it required ‘good people skills’ when it came to women. I learned how to flirt and converse in a way that would not only hold their attention, but create interest and curiosity in them about me; like “Hmm, what do we have here in this guy?” It wasn’t a natural skill for me, but a learned skill. And it really paid dividends! Prior to meeting my future wife, I had a slew of dates in my late twenties as I was approaching the age of 30, the age I wanted to get married (this was back in the late 80s). I went from ‘invisible’ in my mid-twenties to ‘a damn hot commodity’ in my late twenties because of the hard work and grinding development of my early to mid-twenties. It started to pay dividends in my late twenties. However, the key was the social skills, now referred to as ‘game’ that made the real difference. Game (my definition), i.e. the ability to carry on a conversation with a woman that was witty and showed intelligence and was backed up by depth of character and a certain level of accomplishment that created IOI’s and sooner or later the tingles in her. It was a bringing to the male-female dance a certain demonstrable degree of status and resources; not the current ‘game’ designed solely to get her to drop her panties as soon as possible and then proceed to pump and dump her. Today??? I don’t know what I’d do in the Sexual Market Place if my late twenties self happened to show up on the scene. It all worked pre-Internet, I have no clue if any of it it would work today in the world of dating APPS, hook-ups, ghosting and apparently limited, and increasingly limited (COVID), face-to-face interactions. It was all designed for the in-person meeting, face-to-face, no computer screens involved; and it required self-development, confidence and certain level of accomplishment/success to pull it all off.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. Ame says:

    thedeti says:
    2020-12-12 at 7:57 am

    I know that for women, the purpose of marriage is making babies and nesting and having a family. But dammit, they have to know that the purpose of marriage for men is to get sex, and if they don’t know that, then they’re not paying attention.

    i have not read past this comment yet but wanted to reply to Deti here … i really don’t think most women know that THE purpose of marriage for men is to get sex unless someone told them/taught them this is true. girls/women do not naturally know this; they have to be told.

    Liked by 3 people

    • cameron232 says:

      WHich is why I keep repeating the following: sex, for the man, is the incentivizing thing that is UNIQUE to the male-female relationship (and the bearing/raising of children but sex and children are obviously closely related). Everything else can be obtained from relationships with other men without the male-female difficulties in psychology, perspective, communication, etc. Other men make superior companions since we have more in common with other men.

      Liked by 3 people

  11. Ame says:

    from the OP …

    If she doesn’t have that kind of high accountability/close knit family relationship (few young women do), then she pulls out all the stops to be accepted in her peer group; whatever that is and whatever that looks like. Humans are social creatures, and women are the most social of all creatures. And women want to be liked and accepted (envied may be even better).

    girls/women need something/someone that holds in their accountability. something or someone that puts pressure on them from the outside. Elspeth had her Dad. Elspeth’s daughters have their Dad. i did not grow up in a good home or environment, but God placed in me at a very young age a huge, HUGE, guilt complex and a HUGE aversion to having to say i’m sorry – which kept me from doing things for which i’d have to say i’m sorry. i also had a huge aversion to getting caught being bad or being perceived as bad, which kept me good. and, although i hate it, i also have a HUGE aversion – massive aversion, instant-full-blown-panic-attack-inducing aversion, to vomiting (me or anyone else) – which kept me from drugs and alcohol and running with those who did (and also kept me from anorexia and bulimia) … because Monday mornings at high school were full of the tales of all that happened over the weekend from the plethora of alcohol/drug parties, kids barfing everywhere, pictures of girls waking up next to guys in hotel rooms not knowing what they did or didn’t do, etc.

    my daughters do not have their Dad (as most of you know that story i’ll not repeat it), but they do have a HUGE aversion to disappointing me … it’s a healthy fear. they’ll both tell you, “If I ever do that my Mama would kick my butt!” recently someone we know earned some jail time, and while discussing this my Oldest said, “If I got arrested I’d tell them to just let me spend the night in jail b/c I’m more fearful of calling and confessing to my Mom than spending a night in jail because my Mama would kick.my.butt!!!” this same thing carries over to dating and sex and all the petting leading up to sex. we are very close … they are not afraid of me, but they do have a healthy fear of not wanting to disappoint me.

    I was raised by a Silent father (no mother first decade of life), so I never really entertained that kind of fantasy life, but it is rampant today, and the influence is powerful. Girls make all kinds of nonsensical decisions if it feeds the imaginary life she’s pined for. It doesn’t help that we’re all being told ad nauseum to “follow our dreams”. Never, EVER underestimate the power of the narrative that plays in the heads of the average woman. Those narratives include travel (what IS it with the travel stuff?), a fabulous job that doesn’t feel like work (it’s like we’ve all forgotten that it’s called work for a reason), and a 6’+ man that is the best of everything both male and female.

    with feminism we’ve taken the fear of parents away from our kids. social groups are easily manipulated and follow the strong one in the group where ever they lead. also, women don’t like to be the only one, so the bad girl wants to corrupt all the other girls so she’s not the only bad one. bad will more easily corrupt good than the other way around. feminism has destroyed families, destroyed father’s role in the family, demeaned men, and made moms their daughters’ bff’s. churches have capitulated to women. there’s nothing and no one left to teach girls the Truth and to model it for them (in general).

    this free-sex, girls can do it as much as guys, has destroyed them in ways they might only begin to recognize in their later years when it’s too late.

    girls have been taught since they were born, and reinforced in every environment they’ve ever been in, that the sky’s the limit .. they can do and be anything they want whenever and however they want … dream big, etc. they’re given everything they want while also being told they deserve these things. and even if they’re experiencing difficult things, they’re being told they deserve the best while being lied to about what ‘the best’ actually is. this is ingrained in them. it’s a part of them. unless someone along the way has taught them differently, they think this is normal. they believe it’s true regardless of what their personal experience tells them is true.

    Great sex can throw a monkey wrench in all that, but it won’t last long if she notices that the dream is slipping from her grasp. If the guy doesn’t tick ALL the boxes, it won’t be enough. She’ll be out; first emotionally, then sexually, then the rest of her. No amount of anything is going to make a woman happy with a man whom she sees as the one thing that kept her from the fabulousness of what she was meant to be. And to her, it WILL be his fault, no matter how good looking or how much sexual prowess he has. If he has money, he might be forgiven, because at least she can show that off. But sans wealth, all bets are off, and most men are not wealthy.

    this is true because no amount of anything will ever make a person happy, and if it’s been drilled into us that happiness is our end-goal, our be-all to end-all, then we’re continuously driven to find that happiness with the things of this world, and we will never ever ever find it here.

    it’s why the bible’s teachings on learning to be content are critical, pivotal, foundational. it’s why teaching that life is NOT fair, just, or equal, is critical, pivotal, foundational. it’s why teaching young women that marriage is not going to continuously make you joyously tingly happy … that marriage is work, that the emotions of love are fickle, that love is a choice, that our vows are a choice. even if we have that hard visceral sexual attraction that Deti mentions, we still have to choose to it. choosing to say yes to one man also means choosing to say no to every.other.man.for.forever. and that is critical. i have no doubt Elspeth has had other men attracted to her, but she has chosen to say no to all of them. if she ever let her mind wander over to saying yes to any of them, she knows she’d be setting herself up for some bad stuff (James 1). it’s a whole lot easier when we have that hard visceral sexual attraction to our husbands to say no to every other man, but we still have to make that choice.

    the sad truth is that the church does not teach contentment; the church teaches that God wants us to be happy.

    as Bloom has often said, feminism has not done girls and women any favors, either.

    Liked by 3 people

    • cameron232 says:

      Great comment – one OT nitpick: “a HUGE aversion to having to say i’m sorry”

      In my experience, almost all women have a huge aversion to admitting fault and having to say sorry, particuarly in their relationships with men. I don’t know if this is natural to women or a result of feminism (men bad, women good).

      I have personally experienced this with women. If she’s forced to be sorry, she’s sorry you hurt, not sorry she hurt you. Or she’s not sorry because she didn’t INTEND to hurt you. Men would never be able to get away with this standard for being at fault – “I didn’t mean to hurt you, so no apology.”

      Liked by 2 people

  12. Ame says:

    here’s an example … young girl on fb asked for people to give advice on how to raise a daughter. i commented that daughters need to be taught the bible and to become who God designed them to be. she did not like my comment. i didn’t think she would.

    on another day same young girl on fb wrote that she’s praying that God would _____.

    so, it’s okay to pray and ask God for what we want … granted, what she’s praying for is good and healthy, but it’s not okay to defer to the bible and God’s Word when it’s our desire to raise strong, independent women, because the bible is not the narrative of culture. what we think makes us happy is the narrative of culture that says we should have what we want and that will make us happy, and happiness is relative to all the things about right now, and ‘right now’ changes.

    culture, and girls since the Garden, have always wanted God to fit into their desires. desires are never fulfilled and are always elusive. but God always fulfills and never changes when we look to Him, alone, to fill the desires of our hearts.

    ‘christian’ girls/women will do just about anything to not read the Bible. look at all the ‘christian’ books out there targeted to girls and women. look at the massive women’s bible study industry. go into a church and ask to teach a women’s bible study based strictly on the bible and not from a book or workbook – they won’t let you. this was all birthed out of the ‘women’s ministry’ movement that began in the 90’s.

    Liked by 4 people

    • feeriker says:

      go into a church and ask to teach a women’s bible study based strictly on the bible and not from a book or workbook – they won’t let you. this was all birthed out of the ‘women’s ministry’ movement that began in the 90’s.

      It’s an especially poisonous trend with women’s “Bible Studies,” but it’s really a key feature of modern churchianity overall. I attended a men’s weekly Bible study several years ago at the tiny Baptist church I used to attend and the pastor pushed the same thing on us men: the churchian version of “Oprah’s Book of the Month Club,” rather than the Bible itself. NOBODY within Churchianity, Inc. seems to want to spend any time reading the Scripture itself (except maybe for the five minutes on Sunday morning spent in collective reading of whatever passage the superficial sermon is based on). This is either because of pure intellectual and spiritual sloth, or, as Ame’s FB correspondent demonstrated, because they don’t like the message behind the content and want some third party to feed them a spiritual junk food substitute that goes down easier.

      Liked by 2 people

  13. Ame says:

    cameron232 says:
    2020-12-13 at 5:44 pm
    Great comment – one OT nitpick: “a HUGE aversion to having to say i’m sorry”

    In my experience, almost all women have a huge aversion to admitting fault and having to say sorry, particuarly in their relationships with men. I don’t know if this is natural to women or a result of feminism (men bad, women good).

    I have personally experienced this with women. If she’s forced to be sorry, she’s sorry you hurt, not sorry she hurt you. Or she’s not sorry because she didn’t INTEND to hurt you. Men would never be able to get away with this standard for being at fault – “I didn’t mean to hurt you, so no apology.”

    thank you, Cameron.

    you’re absolutely right that we women don’t naturally like to say we’re sorry … even Eve didn’t really apologize, she blamed it on being ‘deceived.’ “Genesis 3:13 And the Lord God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?” The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.”

    when i was young, though, i grew up in an abusive home, and since abusers rarely take responsibility for their actions, they have to blame someone, so they blame the victim. my first husband did the same. i grew up believing i was always ‘bad,’ reinforced later by my first husband. so i didn’t want to prove that to be true, if that makes sense. i wanted to be good, and i hated to do anything that would prove i was ‘bad’ and have to say i’m sorry. my now-Husband has lovingly gone to (what i consider) great lengths to help me learn that i’m not always ‘bad’ 🙂 … he’s awesome 🙂 🙂 🙂

    many years ago i was taught (can’t remember how, now) to teach my young daughters to take responsibility for their choices by example. when i would do something wrong, i would apologize to them and ask for their forgiveness. we’re all three (myself and my two daughters) quick to acknowledge our faults and our strengths. sometimes that happens in front of someone else, and they have an interesting reaction. just yesterday my Oldest and i were in line to check out. i said something (benign – can’t even remember now, but it was about something in the store, iirc). my daughter corrected me. i replied, “You’re right.” the woman in front of us turned around, shocked, and commented that her mother would NEVER have admitted she was wrong, ever.

    Liked by 2 people

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