How to Understand Guys with Asperger’s or Autism

Autism spectrum disorders are on the rise. This post aims to help the average person understand the experience of being autistic, for the purpose of increasing mutual rapport.

Readership: All

This article contains the following sections.

  1. Introduction
  2. Educational Resources
  3. Why are Autistic Individuals So Angsty?
  4. Angst caused by Oxytocin Deficiency
  5. Angst caused by a lack of Theory of Mind
  6. Angst Caused by the Misinterpretation of Eccentric Behaviors
  7. Angst Caused by Bullying and Rejection
  8. Descriptions of Successful Aspies
  9. Red Pilled Aspies
  10. Conclusions

Introduction

I think there must be a lot of guys reading Manosphere/Red Pill blogs who have some form of autism, like Asperger’s, yet no blogger ever seems to address their thoughts and needs. Considering how the population frequency of autism has been rising, at some point, they will be so prodigious that we’ll have to learn how to get along with them.

World Prevalence of Autism

Of note, Asperger’s syndrome appears as one of the most common occurrences of high-functioning autism.

Aspergers_in_adults

Educational Resources

If autistic individuals can be properly informed and trained at a young age, they can find it easier to adjust to normal people, and are likely to become much more successful in life, in terms of their social lives, marriages and careers.

Marc Segar offers a self-help-guide for people with autism/Asperger’s, entitled, A Survival Guide For People Living With Asperger’s Syndrome. His book, “Autism and Computing”, launched a blog by the same name, and a Wikibook, Autistic Survival Guide. If you are in constant contact with an autistic person, you may want to read through these sources to glean a few insights. The website Wrong Planet also focuses on the experiences of autistic individuals and how they might best cope with life

In a nutshell, a lot of the most helpful points in Segar’s work cover all the most important lessons that neurotypical people learn about life, such as self-esteem, finding one’s place in the right career, setting personal boundaries and respecting others’ personal space, conveying mannerisms and communicating effectively. One very interesting perspective in Segar’s work is how aspies can ‘best accommodate the apparent stupidity of normal people’.

Some other informative word studies include Monotropism, Sensory Overload, and Trolling.

  • Monotropism” is when a person has a restricted range of interests and can only pay attention to one thing at a time. Researchers theorize that autistics display this behavior as a way to cope with their hypersensitivity to sensory information. Individuals with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder(ADHD) have the opposite sets of behaviors, in which they are unable to focus on one subject for very long. Both types have difficulties in performing tasks requiring attention and concentration.
  • “Sensory Overload” refers to a situation in which there are too many people, too much activity, and too much noise, all of which cause confusion and anxiety for the autistic individual who cannot process this information immediately through intuition.
  • Trolling”  Autistic individuals have an interesting relationship with trolling. For one, many immature, but otherwise normal people, find intense, but cruel entertainment in trolling those with autism. Because of their past experiences of being trolled, some aspies think this is just how normal people interact socially and therefore mimic their behavior in an effort to ‘connect’. But most aspies recognize that being trolled by others is a form of mockery and ostracization. (This facet will be covered in more detail later.) On the flip side, many aspies have been known to troll others, especially on internet forums and blogs. Aspies motives for trolling the internet may range from (1) creating entertainment for themselves, (2) experimenting with, and testing the reactions of others for their own personal education about people’s behaviors and social interactions, or (3) a kind of passive revenge for being trolled themselves, (4) a need for attention or meaningful dialogue. There may be other motivations as well.

Related: BeWytch Me: Asperger’s Syndrome, Autism and Trolling (July 14, 2014)

On a side note, I have long suspected that birth control medications are somehow linked to the rise in autism. (Of course, this is probably only one out of many other factors.) The following papers explore the possibilities of this hypothesis.

Why are Autistic Individuals So Angsty?

I have a couple friends who have Asperger’s. I know they have a very difficult life. It’s not because they’re “dumb”. These guys are actually quite intelligent, and gifted with some special talents. But yet, they find it incredibly difficult to be happy. Other people just can’t understand why they are so deeply troubled, and so they become a drag to the social scene.

I’ll briefly describe four of the most influential factors that lead to this state of angst. My purpose here is not to draw undue pity, but to simply create some empathy which might impart a greater understanding of how to get along with these individuals.

Pink Floyd Scream

Angst caused by Oxytocin Deficiency

An oxytocin deficiency is commonly found in autistic individuals. Oxytocin evokes feelings of contentment, reduces anxiety, and induces feelings of calmness and security around other people. Many studies have already shown a correlation of oxytocin with human bonding, as it increases trust, and decreases fear. This explains why autistic individuals often appear very uptight, formal, suspicious of others, and socially recalcitrant.

This oxytocin deficiency also affects their sociosexual lives. One study confirmed that there was a positive correlation between oxytocin plasma levels and an anxiety scale measuring the adult romantic attachment.

In other studies, it has been shown that in order for a person to reach full orgasm, it is necessary that the brain regions associated with behavioral control, fear and anxiety are deactivated; which allows individuals to let go of fear and anxiety during sexual arousal. This suggests that oxytocin may be important for the inhibition of brain regions that are associated with behavioral control, fear, and anxiety, thus allowing orgasm to occur.

Angst caused by a lack of Theory of Mind

Theory of Mind is defined as the capacity to mentally represent thoughts, beliefs, and desires, regardless of whether or not the circumstances involved are real. Many individuals classified as having autism have severe difficulty assigning mental states to others, and in interpreting verbal intonation and other non-verbal expressions as indicators of specific mental states in others. This condition is often called “Mind Blindness”.

In other words, guys with Asperger’s lack discernment. They have a horrifyingly low Emotional Quotient (EQ). They truly don’t know what other people are thinking or feeling, unless those people do or say something obvious to reveal it. Because of this, it is impossible for them to know what is an appropriate response to people in a particular social setting. This condition also lays the foundational social elements of being ‘out of touch’, which then attracts taunting and trolling from others.

Marc Segal’s Autistic Survival Guide points out that autistic individuals cannot sense the emotional context of a social setting. He describes the dynamics of this effect as follows.

  • Non-autistic people tend to get ALL aspects of social interaction 50-99% right, ALL the time.
  • Autistic people can get aspects 100% right or 200% wrong, yet rarely, if ever, will an autistic person be able to achieve 50% of all the aspects.

I can embellish this assessment, based on my own understanding gained from autistic friends and students. Autistic individuals have the viewpoint that neurotypical people always make a game of judging each other by how close they can get to 100% (see Segar’s section on ‘Confidence’).

This may be at least part of the reason why it is difficult for auties to get explanations out of non-autistic people. It takes a lot of time and concentrated effort for a non-autie to transform their subconscious mental processes into socially descriptive words, it usually also exposes their basic desires and deeper motives, which can be embarrassing as well as risky.

Furthermore, normative people seem to regard an autie’s need for explicitness as an attempt to “cheat the game”. That is to say, from a non-autistic persons point of view, why would I want to go through all the hassle, risk, trouble and time necessary to give a small piece of emotional information to an autistic person who has not first demonstrated an ability to use said information discretely and wisely, and then also not betray my humble frankness?

These contrasting viewpoints reveal how tedious a social interaction can be, not just for normies, but for autistic individuals as well. Obviously, this difference in perception creates a vast barrier between communication styles, which affects every aspect of interaction between an autie and a typical person.

Angst Caused by the Misinterpretation of Eccentric Behaviors

One tragic consequence that results from mind blindness is the inability to judge the context of a social situation with enough accuracy to be able to fit in. Because of the inherent difficulties involved with understanding others, many autistics tend to give up on pursuing meaningful social interaction, and focus instead on the hard work of maintaining their own emotional balance, and obtaining peace of mind. They also fail to express this autorejection in a way that others can understand. As a result, most people misinterpret the eccentricities of autistics as rude, inappropriate, or unacceptable behavior.

The following video identifies five characteristic behaviors of autistics, and the common misinterpretation of these behaviors.

Cliff’s notes for the video are as follows.

“There is always some distress, anxiety, or obsession manifested in every ‘inappropriate’ behavior that gets misinterpreted by others.”

The most common misinterpretations of behaviors common to autistic individuals are listed as follows.

  1. A “low tolerance for boredom” is misinterpreted as laziness.
  2. The inability to “read” others is misinterpreted as lack of empathy.
  3. Poor “emotional regulation” is misinterpreted as psychological instability.
  4. Detachment is misinterpreted as narcissism.
  5. Deficits in social skills are misinterpreted as abnormality.

Angst Caused by Bullying and Rejection

Simply put, one of the biggest problems faced by autistic individuals is social rejection. This, in addition to the frequent trolling and bullying, are the most crippling reasons why auties find it very difficult to be happy. From the viewpoint of an autistic person, nearly everyone is a bully, and this is largely because most people are careless, and often cruel.

People have a schadenfreudian nature, in which they don’t want to see someone who is socially awkward and unfamiliar with being happy, to actually be happy. *

Also, facing someone with an apparent handicap is deeply embarrassing for some unjust reason, and the average person just can’t tolerate it. So, no one wants to talk with them, listen to them, or be around them. At worst, most people talk to them, and about them (often behind their backs) with scorn and ridicule. As a consequence, autistic individuals are subjected to excessive amounts of rejection on a daily basis.

In addition, people unfamiliar with autism spectrum disorders naturally assume that autistics are capable of playing the social game (as described in the previous section). But since they can’t, those people think it’s fun, easy, and ego stroking to win a social spar against an Aspie (not to mention juvenile and cruel). To offer an analogy, if a man had polio, very few people would be so cruel and rude as to call him a ‘crip’, and kick his one good leg out from under him. But people ignorantly think it’s OK to do that, in a figurative sense, to individuals on the autism spectrum.

This video briefly outlines some of the pressures experienced by adolescent autistics.

* This social reaction is apparent, not just for autistics, but for every person with any type of disability, ingrained problem, or spiritual stronghold. At the risk of appearing too ‘liberal’, I need to say that Christian charity requires us to willfully overcome the callousness of our nature towards the neighbor who is disadvantaged. Adopting this one Christian attitude will drastically improve your relationship with an autistic person.

Descriptions of Successful Aspies

Many noteworthy and famous people have, or are suspected to have, some form of autism. Ranker.com offers lists of a few of these people: 16 Famous People with Autism and Celebrities Who (Probably) Have Asperger’s Syndrome.

Back in 2015, I came across a blog written by an aspie named Penelope Trunk. At that time, I thought her writings had a lot of passion and optimism, which I found admirable, but I also found her works to lack some basic landmarks of logical purity. (Maybe that is just a symptom of being female.) Since then, she has developed a very successful writing career, and has founded a small business. [I don’t agree with many of her viewpoints, but I mention her here, because I think some people might be intrigued by her honest writings, and inspired by her professional success, while knowing that she is autistic.]

Personally, I know one guy with Asperger’s who has a professional hobby of restoring classic guitars. I’ve seen him take very valuable, but ruined instruments, and repair them. He has restored several old Gibson Les Paul’s with broken headstocks. He cuts out the cracks and splinters, and makes a jig to cut intricate splines and tenons to fit into the joint. He glues all the pieces together like a wooden puzzle and puts several clamps on it. After trimming off the glue and sanding it smooth, he paints the headstock black with a sunburst fade into the natural mahogany finish at the end of the neck. Finally, he replaces the “Les Paul” decal, and finishes it with a clear coat of lacquer. No one can tell that it had ever been broken.

This guy is happy when he is restoring these classic guitars. Many people are inspired by his work, and offer him encouraging words concerning his artistry. For him, the best part is that people leave him alone, and stop noticing his shallow breathing. He enjoys it because he can get into flow, and he makes pretty good money at it too.

Red Pilled Aspies

Guys with Asperger’s have one Red Pill advantage that I have noticed, so this takes us to the Orange Pill.  The Manosphere often instructs men to not take women’s words seriously, but to examine their behaviors instead. Most guys with Asperger’s are naturals at this. *  They have told me some profound insights on women.  Here are a few things I’ve learned about women from Asperger guys.

  • The easiest way to p!ss a woman off, and set her off balance, is to look at her smugly, and give her a cold smile without saying anything. It makes them self-conscious, and they lose confidence. They will typically lash out in self-defense by calling you a pervert. [Heh… Aspies are not Alphas, you know.]
  • Some women get slut eye, and start chewing food with their mouth open when they have the Tingles for a man nearby. They do this (presumably) because they’re insecure and feel vulnerable. [LMAO!]
  • Women have the mindset that all the world is a stage, and they’re always trying to do their best act. That’s why they stay in groups, and go places (like the restroom) in groups – because they’re insecure about their act. The need to talk about each other’s performances, give each other tips for improvement, and support each other. It’s like a football team taking a break at halftime and getting a revised play strategy from the coach, and if one of them screws up their act, then the whole team gives them hell. [I thought this one was hilariously true.]
  • Women are always trying to make other people emotional, often in an attempt to sabojack and control the social interaction. [I was so intrigued by this viewpoint, that I studied it in a previous post, Why do Women Incite Others to Emote?(June 19, 2018)]

* The negative caveat to having this skill is that Aspies cannot detect some of the emotional information that could be beneficially associated with the obvious tells.

aane-diagram-possible-challenge-1440x1182

Conclusions

The figure above shows several challenges of personal regulation that autistic individuals face, related to the intake of sensory information, the processing of emotions and anxiety, and the willful control of attention and impulses. These areas of difficulty include,

  • Cognitive Flexibility: Difficulty in two skills – flexible thinking and set shifting.
  • Central Coherence: Not being aware of the present moment.
  • Executive Functioning: Not knowing what to do in a given circumstance, and after knowing, finding difficulty in the efficacious performance.
  • Theory of Mind: Not being able to determine the thoughts, feelings, and intentions of others.
  • Hidden Curriculum: Not understanding what is expected of them within a social context.
  • Social Pragmatics: Not knowing what will bring ‘success’ in a given social situation.
  • Self Advocacy: Not knowing how to express themselves in a way that others can immediately comprehend.

In addition to these challenges, autistic individuals usually experience intense levels of anxiety and anger on a continual basis, and this is because of a combination of the following factors.

  1. A lack of trust and bonding caused by low oxytocin.
  2. Their ‘mind blindness’ (an inability to postulate a theory of mind in others) causes them to be unable to intuitively sense the thoughts, feelings, and intentions of others. This leads to regret, frustration and disappointment.
  3. Their inability to gauge the social context of a situation prevents them from being able to know how to respond appropriately, and blend in harmoniously.
  4. Other people misinterpret their eccentric behaviors as abnormal, psychotic, lazy, careless, unfeeling, narcissistic, unacceptably rude, or as having malicious intent. Such assessments are not representative of the autistic person’s true thoughts, feelings, and motives.
  5. Their general sense that the world is full of stupid, careless, and cruel people, which is reinforced by daily trolling, bullying, and rejection.

As a result, autistic individuals usually display the following characteristics, among others.

  1. They continually experience angst, and find it very difficult to be happy.
  2. They tend to recoil into their private inner world, where they are more comfortable.
  3. They turn their attention to particular activities in which they are skillful.
  4. They require a long time to acquaint themselves with other people well enough to trust them and get along with them.

People who are in contact with autistic individuals on a regular basis, and who wish to improve their relationship with the person, should remember the following.

  1. Accept the fact that the autistic person faces great difficulties in simple social exchanges.
  2. Adopt a formal personal presentation whenever interacting with an autistic person. This will make them feel more respected and less apprehensive.
  3. Exhibiting serenity, reasonability, altruism, and patience, will be interpreted by the autistic person as dignity, intelligence, kindness, and acceptance, respectively.
  4. Recognize that the autistic person lacks a great deal of emotional and intuitive information that most people take for granted. Be as verbally explicit as possible, without being condescending. Autistics do not readily comprehend sarcasm and allusions.
  5. Autistic individuals are overtly sensitive to disorder, noise, and seemingly random displays of strong emotions. Large crowds, anger, shouting, loud noises, and abrupt changes to schedules are deeply unsettling for the autistic person.
  6. Avoid the temptation to tease, taunt, or troll the person. Also avoid being sarcastic or aggressively angry towards him. This is very important. One slip will destroy much hard-earned trust.
  7. Try not to presume cruel or careless intent on behalf of the person. In the event that he has spoken rudely or acted offensively, try to discuss this with him privately as a caring friend, and explain why his behavior was unacceptable. If he responds with confusion, you may also need to tell him how to respond in a more appropriate manner. If he responds with anger, you may not have yet developed sufficient standing with him.

If you can gain sufficient trust and rapport with an autistic person, you may be intrigued to discover some of his unique and useful insights on specific people, the social behaviors of normal people, and the world in general.

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About Jack

Jack is a world traveling artist, skilled in trading ideas and information, none of which are considered too holy, too nerdy, nor too profane to hijack and twist into useful fashion. Sigma Frame Mindsets and methods for building and maintaining a masculine Frame
This entry was posted in Disorders, Personal Presentation, Psychology, Relationships. Bookmark the permalink.

22 Responses to How to Understand Guys with Asperger’s or Autism

  1. Ame says:

    Excellent. I’ll read and watch links later, but this is excellent.

    Like my daughter who’s Aspie, many have other diagnoses which makes it even harder.

    It was interesting to read the because so much that we do for her I don’t even think about anymore. Having it ‘explained’ found me nodding my head and thinking, “Exactly.”

    Liked by 3 people

  2. yesmoreblogs says:

    Really informative post. I support people with all different ranges of autism.

    Like

  3. Stephanie says:

    I counseled a woman with an Asperger’s husband awhile back… it was so hard for BOTH of them to make a good marriage together.

    Just some things that you pointed out that were also difficult in their marriage:
    -Communication issues – him not being able to really explain his emotions well or expectations or disappointments or moodiness
    -Him needing a lot of alone time – more than she felt like she could emotionally and mentally handle
    -Her not understanding his unique needs
    -Him desiring intimacy and sex but having no idea how to communicate that need in a way she would respond well
    -Her denying him sex constantly because he wasn’t meeting her emotional needs and expectations
    -Him falling for another woman who was kind and nice toward him for the first time in years 😦 the affair playing tricks on his mind to seem like it was his answer to everything
    -Her now having to deal with the fact he’s in love with another woman (probably for life, because the emotions created in an affair tend to last for years)

    It’s really hard to help couples in a situation like this. The selfishness on a wife’s part to demand her husband to do what she knows deep down he is probably incapable of doing (meeting all her emotional needs etc.) is kind of hard to accept for me. I get it that women want their needs met, but at some point they have to understand how much their husbands can realistically do.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. seventiesjason says:

    Agree that this exists and is real, unlike ADD / ADHD however…….didn’t we just call this a “personality quirk” a few generations back? Didn’t a person suffering from this or aspects of this on some levels just have to “deal” and “learn” skills to adjust? Like through a hobby (the guy who repairs classic guitars you mentioned for example?) through some mild counseling, or their own life experiences of “Hey…..gotta work on this…..will change what I can, and what I cannot I adapt and understand personal limitations, and grow others.”

    My undergrad is in Special Education, and I have worked with full-blown Autistic individuals. Do you think or even believe that some of this is just another “syndrome” that people classify themselves under in order “not” to change? “Well I have Aspergers so you have to adapt to me, my needs, my malapadtive behaviors and provide accomodations for me in school, work, social life?”

    Could it be argued that everyone is “somewhat autistic”?

    Socilization in the West today (and for a awhile) is making people ruder, meaner, nastier and badder (like an out of control cocaine addiction). I can see and understand, and empathize…..the world won’t change for your need, or what “it could be”

    I was bullied hard, and I got over it during college……..but that damage can be crippling for years to come, long after the fact of it happening…….but it DID get tiring of using this as a crutch to why my life wasn’t going right.

    I had to let it go. I am not saying to be harsh to folks who are suffering here…nor should we be giving a “b*tch slap of reality and to be cold” but really…..life goes on. You have to end the end play the hand you have been dealt.

    I have a brother with Downs Syndrome with profound mental retardation, and massive health problems and he still holds a job down as a dishwasher at a hotel back in New York State. Men, women, and children walked out from the liberated death camps after WW II and made something of themselves……hard as it was. Same with POWs………met many a Vet from the Vietnam era who saw some horrid stuff and yet……..worked it out. Now We have Iraq War Vets who never saw combat haveing therapy animals for anxiety……..

    Could we in Special Education, and in the man-o-sphere, and in our churches be working to help instead of just accomodating?

    No one likes being told (including me on my entranched beliefs about women for example) that “you MAY be wrong” or “You know, you should WORK or LOOK into this or that”

    Changing a learned behavior is hard, and I am not belittling this…….but sometimes, the “only thing you can change is you”

    Liked by 1 person

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  6. earl says:

    We all can’t have the same personality. Rather than trying to conform everyone’s personality to our own…we should learn from each other.

    Seems like Aspies have pretty good observation skills…lol never know about the chewing with her mouth open when she has tingles. The football metaphor and controlling everything by making things emotional are dead on too.

    Liked by 1 person

  7. Gunner Q says:

    seventiesjason @ 2:30 pm:
    “Agree that this exists and is real, unlike ADD / ADHD however”

    ADD is real, too, just overdiagnosed. I wonder if it was simply not a problem before the Information Age with its profound demands for attention span & recall.

    “Could it be argued that everyone is “somewhat autistic”?”

    It’s obvious they aren’t normal if you spend time around them. It’s good to accept responsibility for one’s behavior but bad to push broken people to ‘not be broken anymore’. People with damaged backs can avoid physical labor and the colorblind can avoid visual arts but autistics still need to socialize. That’s the simple reason they tend to be frustrated.

    If things are confused these days, it’s because victimhood is so heavily rewarded that people learn to fake disabilities, and if a lot of people in the Blogosphere identify as autistic, it’s because blogging lacks the emotional contexts that they find so difficult.

    Heck, these days I can’t socialize either. Wasn’t long ago I could have a social life just by hanging out at the game store after work and chatting with whoever breezed in. Now my every social interaction must be scheduled and scripted on social media. Can’t even ‘grab a burger with the guys’ at lunchtime anymore… it’s like daily life is taxing everybody so heavily that we don’t have time or energy to live.

    Liked by 2 people

  8. seventiesjason says:

    Will disagree with ADD.It’s a made up disorder, and even if real….it is again some sort of personality quirk………

    In Christian circles and work I see more and more of this “Meyers Briggs” personality test being used for potential dating, what someone should be or study and basing their whole life around a bunch of “metrics” from the WW II era….and it being used as “well I’m this personality…so the job, work / life / people should cater to me and my very unique needs”

    It’s used as an excuse to show up late to work, to not do certain tasks, to do what you want pending your personality type. Exactly the person I should date. Time limits on tasks…..we wouldn’t want to offend someone and judge them on their personality that they cannot ever, ever change……..

    What a crock. It palces all the burden on an employer, a potential date or spouse, and everyday people in the street to be able to commicate, work with and deal with their special needs and takes all the responsiblity for their personality off themselves.

    I liked this post. It was written with heart, and a true concern and its something to be aware of…..now with that said, to me………it comes off “these folks do this, this, and that” and that’s the way they are, deal with it. Accomodate them…..but since they have this crippling syndrome…they don’t ever have to even attempt to change some of their patterns or ways”

    I don’t think enabling anyone with an challenge is a good thing. And I may not have Aspergers, and no I don’t have a broken back……but I do have paranoia I have to control, and work on (past drug abuse). I do have other issues I face day to day that others don’t. I deal. Must deal. I lose arguements. I cannot convey some theorhetical topics and ideas in a concrete way……but I try, or try to learn. I don’t and no longer use excuses to justify why I don’t understand, or why I cannot do something or get over something because “that’s my personality / disorder / disability or challenge so YOU accomodate ME”

    I am also exceptional and great at some things. That’s life. That’s real.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Ame says:

      seventiesjason – you make some great points. I have more thoughts and will try to remember to come back when I can type them out ( just injured my hand). You described the constant struggle I have as Mom to an aspie/ special needs daughter.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Stephanie says:

        That’s what I was thinking when I read Jason’s comments, too, Ame! He captured the struggle between (as a Mom or guardian or teacher) trying to get someone to control something as much as they can, but also recognize it can be a problem.

        And it’s interesting to think that all people have something they have to deal with. Albeit maybe some things are much harder and unfair. I don’t know… Jason’s comment was really good at looking at the whole picture.

        Like

  9. Gunner Q says:

    seventiesjason @ 8:15 pm:
    “Will disagree with ADD.It’s a made up disorder, and even if real….it is again some sort of personality quirk………”

    I had the interesting misfortune to suffer ADD for many years. That’s exceptionally unusual; I’m the only adult-onset ADDer I know of in medical literature and also the only one to find a cure (chiropractic). It’s a real condition and not fun at all.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. seventiesjason says:

    How did you finish college with ADD? Hold a job? Go without an IEP / special ed plan in high school and grade school? How do you balance a checkbook? How do you make friends? How do you complete tasks?

    ADD / ADHD diagnosis teaches that these folks are helpless, and need medication, and are “disabled”

    I believe some people have a problem with focusing. Some people have a problem learning math. Some people have this problem or that problem…….ADD is an excuse to be “disabled” and again abscond ANY responsiblity for their personal actions or why they “cannot” do anything except get a “check” from the state or county………..or in most very tragic cases today with young boys…..med them up on very dangerous psychotropic drugs intially prescribed by a school psychiatrist. The even more tragic result is that these boys are regulated into “remedial classes” or “special ed” and never improve…..going AGAINST what special ed was setup for. Most are mainstreamed along, and just “passed”

    These boys by the time they are late teenagers now are slamming speed, getting into meth and now are legitimately “an addict” or “stunted” in most cognitive abilities.

    Here in California, the state is fast at work of classifying this as a “disablity” (ie getting SSI and other benefits pretty much for life)

    Pre 1992, you had the very rare occasion of a grade-school aged boy on meds like this. Now, we have in some elementary schools 30% or more of all boys on these drugs. I was shocked in 2013 when I went to meet with a teacher of one of my Cub Scouts…..I arrived at “med time” at the school. The line was over 100 long. Just about ALL boys. There is zero reason or excuse for this. I hold the public school system to blame. I hold the parent / parents too….moreso the schools…they will bully parents now into anything with the threat of calling CPS on them

    If I were king, many a “psychaitrist” would have their license pulled, and jail time issued.

    I argued heavily against “facilitated language” in the early 1990’s while a teacher in training, I was called all kinds of terrible names. I was shamed by “experts” because I “didn’t know anything” including “reading teachers” as well.

    By the mid 1990’s it was considered a “bunk science”

    ADD is a personalithy quirk. It may be localised or systemtemic. It can be remeded in children with concrete goals, applications and PHYSICAL EDUCATION / GYM class. Been to a modern gym class in school? Zero physical activity. Boys need to run. They need to get this out so they can sit still. They don’t need meds. Perhaps gentle counseling is needed as well. Study skills. Routine and drill.

    Seen too many messed up kids by horrible diagnosis and a smug “we know better” attitude from the experts in the school systems…usually angry middle aged women who have more loyalty to a Teachers Union and diktats from the local Democratic Party.

    Sorry we disagree. This makes me so angry

    Liked by 1 person

    • Wayne says:

      Jason, it seems that your argument is not really about the authenticity of ADD or personality quirks, but rather how badly this characteristic is regarded and dealt with. I think Gunner could agree on this point.

      Liked by 1 person

  11. Ame says:

    one of the problems with over-diagnosing is that those who have a true, legit diagnoses often get lost in different ways.

    all this makes me angry, too. my daughter had to be medicated to survive in public school. after i pulled her out to homeschool her, she quit all her meds.

    still just have one good hand so short comment so not addressing everything.

    there’s a balance btw acknowledging a ‘disability’ and over-accommodating a disability. i tell my daughter that it IS hard she has all this stuff, but God made her smart enough to deal with it. does she still need help? absolutely. but she’s continually moving forward, even if just slow baby steps.

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  12. Ame says:

    coming back to all this a little bit …

    it’s interesting … and hard on Mama … to watch my daughter interact with others. what she perceives to be true and what actually is true are often two different things. for example, she will perceive that she is best friends with someone when that someone only sees her as a casual friend. what neurotypicals define as BFF, and what my daughter defines as BFF, are two different things. however, while i think she understands there’s a difference, i do not know if she experiences sorrow over it, or longing, or wishes it were different … meaning, i do not know if she experiences it as a loss, which is how i perceive it to be.

    and in that vein … idk if that’s because she and her sister and i are all three so close, so she doesn’t have a void in her life that needs to be filled, or if it’s just b/c of who she is, and her needs are different than mine. or maybe a combo of both.

    she does like social interaction but in limited amounts. she has no need to be texting and messaging or talking to a friend frequently or regularly. occasionally is just fine with her.

    so, for example, i watched her with two other girls as they were getting ready for camp. the two other girls are obviously very close friends, but the three of them have known each other since elementary school. my daughter would say she is VERY close friends with these two and the rest of the girls in this group (about 14 in all), she would even describe them all as BEST friends, and she would even say she KNOWS they are all great and wonderful girls. but in reality, in a neurotypical world, she is not bff’s with any of them, and she doesn’t know enough about any of them to make judgements about their moral or ethical character outside of the group within which she knows them. she’s never hung out with any of them or texted or emailed or called any of them (or whatever form of communication kids are using these days 🙂 ). and while she has moments where she wishes she could see them more often, they are just moments. and then she’s back in her own world.

    as her Mom, i sometimes have a difficult time seeing her life through her own eyes rather than mine. where something like this breaks my heart, it doesn’t affect her much at all.

    so parenting an aspie is a mixture of a lot of things. it’s helping to develop this child into the person and adult God created her to be and become. it’s helping her to learn how to adapt in a neurotypical world. it’s helping her learn social behaviors by rote rather than response. it’s helping her understand her own behavior and how it does and does not fit in a neurotypical world and then how to adapt quickly when necessary.

    does she need accommodations sometimes? yes. some of that’s b/c of her asperger’s/autism, but a lot of it is because of other things such as her severe dyslexia which limits her ability to read accurately and quickly. while her comprehension and analytical levels are extremely high, they are only accurate if the information she receives is accurate, so if she misreads text, her comprehension and analysis and therefore ability to adapt to the text (instructions, etc) will be inaccurate. so, in education she has an accommodation to have all text read to her. she will read along, but she still needs it read to her. she also has spatial issues – her eyes do not track movement well (hence, she is 18 and still does not drive). in school type work that means she does not move information accurately from one place to another. for example, she would not be able to transcribe accurately from a chalkboard to her paper … or she would know the correct answer is ‘C’ but fill in bubble ‘B,’ so she also had an accommodation for transcribing. or if she’s doing a math problem and needs to move numbers through the problem to reach the solution – she knows the processes, but she often does not transcribe accurately along the way. irl, her tracking is an issue, although technology and text-to-speech and calculators are well-used tools for her.

    i think the bottom line in life is that … everyone has something. everyone. and we all need to learn how to figure out how to make life work with other people and their something working with our something. often times it’s very helpful to understand people’s something enough so that it’s not a hindrance. i don’t have to completely understand all the things out there, but i need to understand enough to know (1) idk everything, and (2) how we can work together or get along together to accomplish whatever goal we need to in this situation we’re in.

    in that light, it’s very helpful to understand aspie’s. they just don’t see life through the same lens neurotypicals do. and that’s neither good nor bad nor right nor wrong, it just is. if you are working with an aspie or have one in your life, it is good to know enough about their something to get along well to accomplish any goals the two of you might need to accomplish together. it’s not much different than meeting a person who doesn’t have a right hand, and rather than expect them to shake hands with a hand they do not have, you adapt and shake hands with your left hand. or if someone is blind you don’t expect them to be able to read. or if they’re deaf you don’t expect them to be able to hear. or if they’re in a wheelchair you don’t expect them to walk. being a mental disability it’s more difficult to visually ‘diagnose,’ but there are often clues. you don’t even have to understand what the clues mean … just know enough to know there’s something to figure out how to bridge the gap to make that situation work.

    some might see these things as ‘excuses’ … and i have no doubt a lot of people use them as excuses. i see them more as explanations. reasons. my daughter cannot be expected to read and comprehend accurately b/c she may or may not be able to accurately read any given text at any given time. so, she has things read to her. and we spell words for her b/c accurate spelling ties into all that. audio books are wonderful. text-to-speech is wonderful. calculators are wonderful. it’s not a big deal. it just is. adapt the best you can, do the best you can, find an environment that will work with you, and move forward. not all environments will work for all people – even neurotypicals. having a ‘thing’ like asperger’s may very well limit you, but then you just have fewer choices. it just is.

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  14. OKRickety says:

    Detachment is misinterpreted as narcissism.

    How? The detachment I’ve seen with Asperger’s does not seem like narcissistic behavior to me.

    My curiosity is piqued because, during my divorce, I found my wife had a copy of Malignant Self-Love: Narcissism Revisited by Sam Vaknin. During the divorce process, we got a diagnosis of Asperger’s for our 16-y-o son.

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